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Announcer [00:00:00] If you’re looking for the skills and tools to succeed in real estate investing, you’ve come to the right place. This show is about breaking through barriers, breaking through limiting beliefs and breaking through to the life that you want to live through the power of real estate investing. This is the Breakthrough Real Estate Investing podcast, and now here are your hosts Rob Break and Sandy MacKay.
Rob Break [00:02:55] Hello, everybody, and welcome back. Once again, we’re happy you could join us for another exciting episode of Breakthrough Real Estate Investing podcast. As usual, here with me again is Mr. Sandy MacKay. Sandy?
Sandy Mackay [00:03:09] Hey Rob, very good, very good. Happy to be back and record another episode full of content.
Rob Break [00:03:15] Yeah, I’m super excited to be back here. I always enjoy doing these, and the last few have just been, you know, they’ve left me with a lot of inspiration and a lot of hope for like the investing strategies that I don’t necessarily take advantage of, that I think has opened some new doors and things like that for me. So. And this one no doubt is going to be more of the same of that. So I’m very excited about that. Before we get into it, of course, everybody knows. Go over to break through REIT podcast Dot S.A. Download our free report. Get on the email list. Listen to all the episodes that we’ve done over the past years. All of them are there available to be to be listened to, take advantage of all the great guests that we’ve talked to and all the info that they’ve shared with this. And I mentioned the free gift, Sandy. You want to talk about that
Sandy Mackay [00:04:12] the ultimate strategy for a really wealthy real estate. You can pick up a free report. There kind of goes through how we how we’ve built our businesses and implemented the strategy we use in investing in real estate and how you can do. You also get on the email list, of course, and then you will never miss out on a show or an event or anything else we got going on. So, yeah, go do that right now. Break through REIT podcast
Rob Break [00:04:33] and jump over on iTunes. Leave us a rating review there. You guys know, helps us out a lot. If you haven’t done that yet, please go over to iTunes. Leave us a rating. Leave us a review. Let us know what you like, what you don’t like, who you want to hear, what kind of information you want to get out of us. And we’ll make sure that we tailor some future episodes to give you guys all that great information. And of course, you can click on all of our social media links and all that kind of. Stuff and stay connected with us. So one thing I wanted to mention, too, is, you know, if you’re listening live, jump on and ask our guest some questions today. We’d really like to interact with you guys, those of you who are listening to it right now. You know, get on, interact, ask some questions. We know you have them. Don’t be shy. We’d love to hear from you.
Sandy Mackay [00:05:21] Yeah, get on. And that’s if you’re listening to this, you’re probably you probably could have listened to this a few weeks ago or at least a week or a month ago. So join us on Facebook and YouTube. Just go like or subscribe to our channels and you will be able to jump on, live with us, ask whatever questions you have for our guests or ourselves. So go do that if you haven’t already.
Rob Break [00:05:40] Yeah, it’s breakthrough real estate investing on Facebook, right?
Sandy Mackay [00:05:43] That’s it. And I on YouTube.
Rob Break [00:05:44] You know, I’ve got a bunch of things that I’m almost on the cusp of being able to talk about, but right now I’m just going to leave it. You know, I’ve been doing a lot of thinking, been reassessing my why and, you know, as life progresses, things change. And so I’ve got I think here’s some exciting things to talk about in the future. But right now, nothing is solid, so I don’t want to talk out of line.
Sandy Mackay [00:06:09] I hope they’re buying a hotel or moving to Costa Rica or something. I hope something like that.
Rob Break [00:06:14] You know, it has to do well. We’ll talk about it. They’re very excited. There’s some stuff going on.
Sandy Mackay [00:06:19] Awesome. So tune in for our next episode after this hour episodes and they might find out what’s going on.
Rob Break [00:06:25] Yeah, I’ll lead it down the road, maybe four or five more episodes just to get more people listening. OK.
Sandy Mackay [00:06:30] All right. Exciting. Exciting. Well, yeah, we do share a few things of what’s going on in our lives on this show. I’m excited to learn what that is. That’s the thing about it, too. So looking forward to it?
Rob Break [00:06:42] Yeah, absolutely. Well, with Sandy, what about you? What’s going on, you know?
Sandy Mackay [00:06:48] Well, as you said that reassessing it, I’m always doing that to every, every few months or month. You know, you get into different conversations and people inspire you to think differently about what your goals are or whatnot. So to be honest, I’ve got to think about that a lot, too. It’s kind of something that’s there’s a lot of stuff going on. I think that you reach a point where you have so many different things happening in investment world or real estate world, and you kind of learn which things you really love, right? So we’re kind of tweaking some things through just to make sure that I’m spending my time in the right spaces and having energy to keep going with everything we’re doing. But yeah, we’re buying properties, building up the brokerage here in the vine area north of Toronto. So if anyone knows realtors or wants to get involved in our operation here, feel free to chat about that. That’s kind of the most exciting thing in my life so far in 2021. Professionally, at least, is the new brokerage and building it up.
Rob Break [00:07:45] Yeah, what’s that called again?
Sandy Mackay [00:07:48] Keller Williams, Legacy’s Realty,
Rob Break [00:07:50] I can see right there. Right behind you on the wall for those who aren’t listening or for those of you who are watching Keller Williams legacies like it’s how you go. Yeah. And I think that that’s like especially when we get to a certain point, right? It is all about where your time is best spent. And I could see, like for you, that’s got to be really rough right now. Not rough, but a challenge, right to figure out where to put your time, where it’s best spent.
Sandy Mackay [00:08:18] Absolutely. Absolutely. I mean, you got to spend it on something you like to do. And that that leads to whatever the why is your next? Why are the big why? You know, we’re talking with that a bit on the show, but that’s cool. Revisiting that or rethinking that, I’m excited to see where that goes, and maybe we’ll talk about that soon, too.
Rob Break [00:08:38] OK, well, let’s talk to our guest. He’s been waiting patiently there. Bradley Watson is with us super excited to have him here rallies.
Sandy Mackay [00:08:46] He’s been realtor for a bunch of errors. Eight years plus podcasters got a great new podcast out there and done better deals, single family deals. Multifamily is raising money. Bradley, welcome to the show. Why don’t you share a bit more about your journey?
Bradley Watson [00:09:01] Well, before I get started, can I just say it’s I’ve been a fan and it’s nice to also be a guest. You guys are OGS in the podcast community and thank you for welcoming me to come and share a little bit. I think this is going to be really cool. So awesome. Yeah, so I’ll tell you guys a little bit about me. So as you mentioned, been in real estate game for, I guess it’s about eight years now, realtor, first, investor second, which is a little different than most people in this community. And over the last year, I’ve been on this hyper fast journey to learn what it actually means to be an investor-based realtor. I started coming back at the beginning the podcast saying, you know what? I’m an investor realtor now. I realize I was not and have had the opportunity with chatting with sellers like yourself. In fact, I’ve Sandy on the show, coming up soon to and many other very successful investors coming on and teaching me what it actually means to be an investor. And so I’ve been on my own personal journey building our portfolio, which we had scaled back as we had young kids, and they’re getting a little bit older now. So we’re really excited, excited to join the community and really get to know there’s only a few people. I mean, it’s a really small, tight knit community and being able to rub elbows and really connect with people at a time when a lot would say, you can’t, you know, with COVID, you think this is an impossible time to network? Not true. I mean, it’s been an unbelievable opportunity to create a podcast, create fans and friends and also be able to connect with likeminded people such as you guys. So it’s been a lot of fun.
Sandy Mackay [00:10:29] Awesome. Yeah. And that’s exactly the area. There’s so many things we can do to pivot our strategies a little bit, perhaps. What do you talk about your real estate investment journey and kind of how you got into this world and how things maybe evolved a little bit along the way?
Bradley Watson [00:10:45] Absolutely. So back in 2014, I got my first place. We had recently gotten married the same year, and we were so within one year we I quit my job. Shortly after getting a mortgage qualified, I got married and I bought my first house. We house hacked, lived in the basement for about 500 bucks a month. It was in a legal duplex out in Brampton and had held on to that. The market during the time was very much a seller’s market, and we said, you know, what should we buy or rent? We actually were kind of torn, which is ironic because I had a license, and we made the right call. We ended up getting a property. Fast forward, we ended up buying another one out in Oshawa because I wanted to learn about the East End for my own kind of real estate journey, just to kind of get a picture from both worlds and did quite well there and kind of grew our portfolio that way. I mean, we were kind of doing it was almost the BR, but like it wasn’t really a formal bur. We didn’t really attack it that way, and we’re able to make quite a decent amount of money. And then eventually we had kids scaled back our portfolio a bit. And now I’m at a point where through learning, sitting back quietly, but maybe not so quiet because of the podcasts and observing, we’ve identified what our next strategy is as a couple, and we’re set to explode. So that’s kind of where
Rob Break [00:12:00] we’re at now. OK, so I wanted to ask you really quick, I don’t want to breeze over any of that. You mentioned that you did sort of a br. You said so there is buy, renovate, refi and rent. That’s what that means. So you would buy something, renovate it, then refinance it with the bank to pull some of that capital that was invested back out and then rent it out and continue to keep it as a rental property. You said, you said you almost did a better strategy. So what do you mean by that?
Bradley Watson [00:12:32] Tell you what we did. OK, so this is you can describe if it’s a burn or not. So we purchased the properties is 2014, bought it for three seventy-three. It was in a state power sale on market, been on for 60 days. More business cards and I’ve ever seen in a listing. And nobody wanted it because there was chicken on the stove in the basement. So we picked it up. We didn’t do a ton of really the made the biggest renovation we did was in the basement bathroom and after a couple of years, we are now naturally the market was going up in value. So that’s why I say it was kind of a bird. We never went in with that intention. We were just happy to be living for next to no money at the time. And so we refinanced that property in order to purchase and set up a corporation. So in a sense, I think the refinance value was maybe four, somewhere between 450 and five, and that was in 2016. So it didn’t happen with the aggression that a lot of investors would take, but absolutely through increasing the value, finding something that was undervalued and then adding a little bit of sweat equity, we’re able to use that to get to our next property. So kind of a br.
Rob Break [00:13:39] Yeah, a little bit of a blur. Maybe we got a for appreciation in there somewhere.
Bradley Watson [00:13:43] Yeah, but so does everybody else. I mean, this is on.
Rob Break [00:13:46] Yes, absolutely. I mean, unless you’re turning it around in three months, which I mean people are doing, you know, and then then they’re only sort of dealing with the sweat equity portion of it. But yeah, I mean, over the past, well, I mean, hundred years, I guess if you want to look back on it that way, the appreciation has always been part of it.
Bradley Watson [00:14:05] I mean, we put 40000 in and at the refi we had 100000 to put into our next property. So we still a pretty successful kind of appreciating.
Rob Break [00:14:13] So, very much. And that was the first one you did.
Bradley Watson [00:14:15] I was my first house. That was my that was my little nest egg, something my wife, I place. My wife did not want to raise kids. We were in a one-bedroom basement apartment, young guy. I think I was 23 or 24 dealing with this kind of learning what that looks like. It was convenient that it was my home because we can kind of keep an eye. But we heard little crazy kids running around upstairs and jumping on all of all of our stuff. So I mean, that’s the game, right? And got to learn a ton as a landlord and what that kind of means. And being on site house hacking, being able to get in, we I think we had put 10. It was 10 percent that we put down, which was all we had. And I was talking to Sandy, and he did very much the same when he started his journey. It was all we really had and that just came from being frugal. My wife and I were both able to cover the cost of our university who had just graduated, and my wife actually had a full paid scholarship at Ryerson, so the money she had set aside for school was what we had to purchase our first place. So. Yeah.
Rob Break [00:15:16] And then from there, you moved on to what was the next
Bradley Watson [00:15:19] property we bought was in Oshawa in twenty sixteen. We bought it was a legal duplex. South side of it was south side of Oshawa, pretty close to the water, probably five-minute walk from the water. And we were finding the challenges of filling the tenancies. We would have 15 appointments book and one person. We’d be lucky if they showed up and there was a 401 drive. We were taking a lot just to try and fill the space. So it was a real kind of nightmare, to be honest with you. And we had that place for a year and just kind of getting to know what it’s like to be a landlord, in fact. But by the time we were, we had one of our tenants came in, wasn’t paying rent. Eventually, they left and stole our stove brand-new stove. So we learned a little bit about that. And I mean, that’s the fun of it. Thank you for the Ontario system protecting landlords and just dealt with that and just licked our rooms. But you know what the funny thing was for me, one of the coolest parts of all of this outside of the investment community is understanding the market, and I love the market. I think you can create wealth just from having your finger on the pulse. And in 2017, I did. I absolutely did. Hadn’t started a podcast yet, but I was doing YouTube videos was telling people, be careful because if the government pulls this rug out from under us very quickly, things are going to change. And we actually sold that property. And I closed in April 2017, which is the closing date was literally within a month of the market, correcting in 2017. So we had a hundred thousand dollars we made in that property in one year, no renovations done just from knowing that market at the time. And that property is now. Obviously, Oshawa and Durham are doing well, but it took at least a year or two from there to get back to the value that we had sold it. And so just from. Yeah. So for that turned out to be pretty cool. We’re able to purchase our property, settled down a little bit and have a very small mortgage and spend time kind of a mid-life retirement, if you will, with my family and raising my young daughters. And so that’s kind of what since then we’ve been sitting and learning and continuing to put out content, dealing with clients and educating. And now we’re looking at bigger and better things.
Sandy Mackay [00:17:26] So awesome. So now going forward, what’s your what’s your kind of what’s your strategy look like investment world right now or and or like, how is it? How is it? How does the outlook look for the for the short future?
Bradley Watson [00:17:38] Yeah, I mean, I’m very excited. I’ve gone through some unique challenges, being someone who is very energetic, love talking to people just sitting on the phone for too long when I should be doing other things. Probably podcast is a great platform to not shut up and be OK if you’ll be OK with that. And so the platform through podcasting has been able to teach me and I’ve learned, I know I want you now formally do burst, and that was kind of my strategy going in. I connected with a lady named Edna Keep and she came on my show and mentioned the idea of multi families, which opened my eyes. At that time, I had investors ready to go with burse single family or small residential Maltese and was ready to do that. And I’ve got a steady source through also guests and contacts. We got off market deals coming in that I mean, you could grab these all day long, all day long. But as I was speaking through it, I was realizing opportunities that exist in the multifamily space. So I’ve decided for me, that’s my next big step. And having access to capital, though, I think finding a deal is harder. Finding capital is very difficult and finding accredited investors that can support those. And I’ve got a lot of them, whether that’s through the podcast, through connecting people, people know I know what I’m doing and the things I don’t know. I know people who do. And so we’re able to make a lot of money. There’s a lot of opportunities here and in a way, I’ve jumped in both feet, and I’ve been burned a little bit. But this year I do anticipate we will have several buildings under our belt and through JVs and strategic partners across Canada. And that’s what we’re planning to do.
Rob Break [00:19:11] So now you’ve talked about partners and the fact that you know, you’ve been able to connect with them through these various outlets like the podcast and that kind of thing. But let’s talk about like, you know, just connecting with someone isn’t really forming a relationship with them. Like, how do you cultivate that JV relationship?
Bradley Watson [00:19:31] Well, I think any of your listeners would agree that the fact that you guys have the podcast gives a level of credibility. Most people who contact me, they’ve already got, they know me. I mean, my life is on display. I mean, even before my podcast, I’ve been doing YouTube videos for four years. You can look back and see my best and my worst, and it’s all there. And that creates a culture where when I talk to someone is like, if you want to get to know me as a JV partner, it’s important that I get to know you, which is going to take a little bit of work on my end. But if you want to know about me, just look my name up. And so that creates a lot of credibility in those conversations. So yes, maybe the phone call is the first one for us, but our dialog has been going on for a long time, and that’s why the relationships are deep, very quick. Once you start to share successes and opportunities, if you bring these deals, which we have to people, those relationships form a hell of a lot quicker when there’s a live opportunity for someone. And so that also forces our relationship to speed up a lot. And so this is where for me, my lesson has been. Choose your partners carefully because it’s very when you got the right deal, it’s easy to find the money when you got the money. You’ve got the right contacts. You can bring the deal, but don’t get as a young guy, I’m 30, but I could shave today. I look like I’m probably in my early 20s. I am. I’m very energetic. I’m ready to go. Like, I mean, I am. So people jump in, they gravitate to that. And the result is, is you can be taken advantage of in a way and just got to make sure you got your bases covered. And having being connected to groups of investors and being able to rub elbows with people, you realize and learn how you can do that, and you grow right. There’s if you’re afraid of making mistakes, you’re not going to go anywhere. I mean, all of us in this room are scared. We all have our fears. We all have, you know, doubts and challenges. It’s not what you’re. You can’t avoid those things you power through them and you keep going despite you have people saying you can’t do it or hoping you fail. I mean, I see you at the top.
Sandy Mackay [00:21:34] I was going to ask how you find the deals because the money part is part of it, obviously marrying those that money with it, with the right deal or right opportunities than any mentioned deal across Canada to not just locally necessarily, but how do you source how resources do currently?
Bradley Watson [00:21:47] I mean, the belt, the belt is getting wider. I probably eat too much. Well, the tool belt is getting a little bit wider. We’ve got the first sauce that I had was off market power sale deals, and I’ve got a steady flow of those that come in. Those are residential, not as much Maltese, but that was kind of step one. So that creates a framework for investors as you start to build that investor database. Right now, we’re sitting over 450 investors that we’re sharing, and people are welcome to jump on our list. I’m at a point where I’m sending one or two a week now from various deals or JV opportunities. So from there I was. I had contacted several large, accredited investors and was able to network with people now across the country and say, hey, because here in Toronto, here in Ontario, money is, it’s everywhere. And I think it’s everywhere across Canada. But once you start to go into other provinces, it’s a little harder to come by. Not too many people are running and investing in a place like Winnipeg to the same extent. They’re investing in Hamilton, for example. So that creates a massive opportunity for me, having a ton of capital to change markets that would otherwise sit quiet. And so through there, I can connect with JV partners who already have deals. They’ve got cap rates that we’re not used to seeing and are happy to share those deals in exchange for money. So that’s one way. Another way that I’ve been able to do it is with wholesalers. I’ve been able again through networking, connecting with people, find people who bring me deals directly, which I have the opportunity, either manage or bring on a managing partner and work with as well. So those ones can also be quite lucrative. I mean, there’s been several I’ve come through where we’ve either tried to jump, it didn’t work or we’ve kind of looked at it and we pass on a lot is that there’s a step right now. I’ve got several deals on the table that are kind of available that we’re not really jumping on, if you will, but those are so in some cases they’ll come from other partners knowing we have the capital. In other cases, they’ll come from people who know we have the capital and can close on those deals. I hope that kind of answers your question. So they range.
Rob Break [00:23:45] Does do you find that even with the wholesale deals now, they’ve become quite competitive?
Bradley Watson [00:23:51] Yeah. And I call it a wholesale deal, but these are coming from wholesalers who aren’t wholesaling them. They’re legitimately off market deals. I’m not picking up. I do get messages for wholesalers and I’m open to it. I’ve got some wholesalers that send them to me first just because we’re able to move on them. But the ones that really excite me are the non-exclusive off market deals that I have no problem paying a realtor for bringing me. I mean, these are people who are very good at sourcing opportunities. And yeah, I have my real estate license, and this is where you kind of have to recognize the role. But I want to be an investor and the tradeoff for that is paying people for the work that they do. And that’s kind of been it’s worked out.
Sandy Mackay [00:24:30] Yeah, it’s Rob. You mentioned that it’s interesting in the wholesale world is changing. I think it’s because of just there’s so much the technology side of things and there’s so much available information out there that it’s not like there’s wholesale deals are necessarily flying under the radar as much as they used to, which makes it. I don’t know if that’s better or if you’re a wholesale seller, it’s probably better.
Rob Break [00:24:50] Oh, well, yeah, for sure it is. But I mean, it’s creating the same, the same type of bidding wars as, you know, what’s going on in the stuff that’s on market as well. I’ve seen a lot of that lately.
Bradley Watson [00:25:07] Yeah, in one sense. But on the wholesaling front, it’s easier to find money to pass those deals along, but it’s so. Much more difficult to source them now, I mean, finding deals is harder than ever, and we’re seeing markets when I’m talking to people outside the GTA. They’re talking about how we’re getting like we’ve got conditions they’ve never seen, like escalation clauses. For example, we’ve seen that in Toronto for a while and they’re just they’re shell shocked. And so a lot of these deals, the wholesales that I tend to see, the guys that are running around, they’re in outside communities and they are experiencing things that they’ve never experienced before. And that’s challenging. I mean, I have one lady that I’m speaking to and well, and I won’t be seeing her this week, actually. And she was given an as this offer. And so this came to me through the grapevine, and I spoke with her, and I said, Let’s just lay this out here. Are you good with me, not representing you because I have no problem submitting you a better as is offer than you got? But I’ll be honest, and this is just again, this is just my good nature side. I’m not the kind of guy that’s scoops these deals. I’ll pick them up from somebody else. But I said to her, if you listen to thing on MLS, you’re going to have multiple offers up. Price can go way over. And she was a little nervous about working with realtors. And so in some cases, I’ll shoot myself in the foot because you want to be honest and you know, I want to take care of her and that’s she’s good with me, just bringing an off-market offer, which I mean, I have no problem taking fifty thousand dollars. Thank you very much. So. But I think I think it’s important people see, as my realtor side is saying, get the deal. But my humanity is saying that there’s we almost have to take care of each other. It’s not just about the money. It really isn’t. So maybe that was off on a bit of a tangent on the wholesale stuff. I don’t do a ton of wholesaling. I’ll pick up wholesale deals, but I don’t see many of them in the multifamily. Like Mid, the small, midsize apartment space. There’s not as much profit margin in there for them, so I don’t tend to cross them as often.
Rob Break [00:27:05] Well, I think you mentioned something very important, and that is the fact that when you have the right deal, the money will be there. It’s almost, I mean, obviously other than the fact that you’ve done your due diligence in order to, you know, grab on to that deal in the first place. But the validation really comes when, you know, when your investor says, yes, that looks great. Let’s do it right. And when that doesn’t happen, it’s almost like the indicator that, OK, well, maybe it’s not the great deal that I thought it was in the first place,
Sandy Mackay [00:27:37] but let’s talk about the market and that a little bit. You mentioned the different clauses in different cities and whatnot and all the crazy chaos that that some people might think is happening in a, I don’t know, in a in a suit Saint Marie or a subway or something. We’ve seen that for years in Toronto, for sure and around the GTA. But what is the what’s happening in the market? You study this stuff a lot where some of the trends out there. How’s the market is? Is there exciting right now or what’s going on?
Bradley Watson [00:28:02] I mean, it’s exciting if you’re on real estate. Yeah, it’s exciting when you recognize that the alternative is to hold cash that’s losing value overnight through inflation and all of these pressures. And it’s good to holding real estate where you can you’re coming up for your renewal and your mortgage payments. Though you refinance hundreds of thousands, it’s still the same payment. I mean, that’s a great thing. But for someone like my kids or the next generation, there is a level of concern in there on what comes next. I mean, what state do you want to live in because you ain’t going to be in Canada? I mean, the prices that are increasing at crazy levels, and I just think it’s a new normal. I think they’re very much like 2017, though, the Bank of Canada, and they would never CMHC. They wouldn’t say this is actually CMHC might be taken care of. Wouldn’t say this is in 2017. It’s not the same thing. That’s what they’ve recently said. We’re not going to change interest rates. We’re not doing this. We’re not doing that. Things are good. If I were to say that there would be a carpet be pulled out, it would happen from the Bank of Canada saying something to the effect of like something’s got to give right. Like when we saw that the big impact that happened was a foreign buyers tax. So when the government steps in? OK, fine. We’re in a bubble. Let’s say we’re in a bubble. Let’s say things are over inflated. I think generally people would agree is an overheating. Everybody’s saying even the biggest critics are now supporters of the marker saying there’s some overheating happening. The only thing that’s going to change that because the fundamentals are leading to the overheating is intervention, and the intervention is what caused a lot of the problems in the first place, you know, first time homebuyer credits pushing that price upward, these caps on prices that kind of artificially inflate lower priced homes. All of these things is now the solution is more of the problem, which is government intervention. And at some point, that will probably happen if you know when that happens, then you can really probably tighten the market. But those are those are some of the I don’t know if that answers your question, but there’s a lot of moving parts right now. The further you are from the city, the better you’re doing right now. That’s what the numbers are telling us. And at some point, I personally believe as a as a supporter of Toronto, I believe the city will rise again. We see that in office spaces already work from home is here for a while, but we, we will, I believe, start to see the cities come back again. We’re already seeing that in vacancy rates across North America. So there is still a place for the city, but for right now, this is the time for the suburbs to shine and they’re taking advantage of it.
Sandy Mackay [00:30:27] So what does someone do if they’re if they’re looking to invest money and in GTA or Toronto in 2021? Like what? What should they be thinking and what should they be doing it? Or should they be on the fence and maybe waiting to see if there’s some intervention and there’s a 2017 repeat of some sort?
Bradley Watson [00:30:44] Yeah, I don’t think this is going to change for a while. I wouldn’t sit on the sidelines if you plan on doing some activity. I guess the saying is don’t wait to buy but buy and wait. And so I think that will continue to be the case. Let’s say hypothetically, prices come down. I was talking to someone recently about this and they said, do you think prices will correct? And my belief is, even if they do, there is way more up than there is down ahead of us. And so be OK with those. Recognize the pressures that are being placed. Supply and demand pressures. I mean, we were laughing. At least I was laughing when they said that we would get over 400000 immigrants this year. The numbers are on track. So let’s not let’s not say there’s no demand. You know, I think there is. And for that reason, it’s my personal opinion, which an opinion is, is about whole. Everyone’s got one and sometimes they stink. And my opinion is that, yeah, I mean, talking to guys like you, talking to a lot of people who are investing, I don’t think it’s a matter of if you invest, but where you invest and people are, they’re running. They’re running to trade in those worthless dollars for things of fixed value. And that includes real estate.
Sandy Mackay [00:31:55] So where you invest being what asset classes, where you’re referring to? Not necessarily location.
Bradley Watson [00:32:00] Both, yeah, both. And not everybody is a real estate. I mean, if they’re listening to this podcast, they’re probably interested in real estate. But there is many fixed assets. I mean, people are the cash is the worst thing. That’s the short of it, right? And this comes from conversations with people who have a lot of it. They realize, where can I spend it? Any opportunity there is in real estate, there’s hundreds of different vehicles, not just types of properties, but forms of investing. I mean, you could do JVs, you could do it yourself. You could do whatever you are, you could flip. I mean, even people have right now in this market, people are becoming flippers without meaning to. You’re picking up a property. And three months later, the value is up a hundred and fifty thousand. OK, I’ll sell it. I mean, now in a couple of months from now, they’re going to be upset that they did, but they got a flip, right?
Sandy Mackay [00:32:47] Yeah, I made a quick hit of cash, why not? It’s yeah, it’s often just the appreciations working out for them. It’s crazy times for sure and all-around Ontario, for sure and beyond. But if you were if you were an investor, would you be looking in Toronto specifically in that market right now or is that is it a market? That’s kind of a good question.
Bradley Watson [00:33:09] I mean, I love Toronto, but no, my sense in the next six months is that the outskirts is going to outperform. But I also know Huma, I know people and psychology is such a big part of what the market does. This is why I saw 2017 kind of coming. People are it’s almost like an elastic band. People are running at such a large number to these outskirt communities to like these cities cannot support this amount of people. That’s going to mean short term massive increases. We look at Durham like unbelievable amount of upside that’s about to come out of Durham at some point, just like they do between the condos in the freehold jumping back and forth. People are going to say, Why the hell am I buying a single-family home at this price per square foot when there is such a massive deal in the downtown core? And we’re already seeing that in condos? I mean, if you actually look at the condo prices, there’s a ton of stability picking up now in the city. We’ve been seeing that since December, but people in the last, depending on when people are getting this, it wasn’t really until February that some of the major news was started to say, hey, it’s actually like if you look at the months of inventory, they’re pretty much the same as the freehold. So. So if I were to predict in any capacity which I’d like to do, I’d say in the next six months, outskirts of Toronto, suburbs are absolutely going to outperform the major city. I think that’s an ongoing thing at some level. If we were to look in the next five to 10 years, I do anticipate that the city of Toronto as an investment will outperform the suburbs. I think that’s generally understood in the long term, and I think that will continue to be the case. But anywhere in the GTA right now is a good bet if you were to really break it down.
Rob Break [00:34:47] There’s definitely some people that I think maybe haven’t thought things through to the level that they should before sort of heading to those outskirts, like thinking that maybe this work from home thing is going to last longer. That probably is. I would imagine that I would like to think anyways that sooner than later, things are going to start to return to somewhat of a normal and people are going to be required to start going back to their jobs, which are located for, you know, the people that I’m talking about. Those jobs are located in downtown Toronto and they’re going to very quickly get sick of that commute. Right. So then, yeah, you’re right. I can see sort of the elastic band effect that you were talking about, right?
Bradley Watson [00:35:34] And it’s a double-edged coin to here like double edge coin. That’s definitely not the analogy. You get my point sort. Yeah, no. To that suicided coin actually was when was just OK. Either one. There’s actually this trend of leaving the city is not a new one. I mean, you could say working from home is the cause. I think it’s maybe jumped us five years ahead, but people were already leaving the city. That’s been an ongoing thing. If you look at the trend the last couple of years, it’s been happening a lot. The problem, too, is this immigration and this inflow of immigration is what does fix that overall gap even with in the last few months in the city of Toronto, even with all of the net outflow of locals in Ontario because they tracked, where are people going? And the biggest levers city being left was Toronto. And then all of these further out cities were the ones where they were all landing. Even with all of that, and even with immigration being beat up, still was a net positive as far as the population of people went. So wait until immigration opens up again, like once you open up that floodgate of inflow population again, I believe not necessarily. People will come back from working from home, which I do think is a possibility. The bigger factor, I’d say, is people will realize working from home is maybe overrated. So we’re not leaving as fast anymore. And why would I spend so much money to be so far away anymore? There’s going to be kind of that give, but then you’re also going to have a massive influx of potential competition coming from every corner of the Earth. I mean, when it comes to moving in in a city, I honestly believe Toronto’s the best place is the greatest destination people can have in the world. So wherever you put that in the category, we’re going to get a lot of people. And when the government is backing it up with incentives for people to come and to stay, not to leave after they’re done school and all these other programs, those things are the reason that I see Toronto rising ahead. People don’t come to Canada to move to Sudbury. They come to Canada to move to Toronto. But then I guess sometimes they get scared, and they run off to Sudbury. But I think the destination will always remain Toronto.
Sandy Mackay [00:37:39] Yeah, it’s a booming market. It’s possibly never, never going to get any time soon because I think the prime factor. Immigration like you’re suggesting, too. So what the heck do you what do you tell someone who who’s who is maybe a 20-year-old and looking to buy their first home and can’t afford it or trying to find their way into the market? How does that person win
Bradley Watson [00:38:01] as a primary residence, like a place to live
Sandy Mackay [00:38:03] or investment either way? Yeah.
Bradley Watson [00:38:05] Well, if it was an investment, I would say you got to decide equity versus cash flow. I think most large investors would all argue cash flow is the play. People who invest in the downtown core, they’re playing an equity game. But these are guys that investors that are too worried if I’m running a negative cash flow because the net result of me paying down equity with low interest rates is I’m still actually ahead, just not from a monthly cash flow perspective. So for someone who wants to invest just to kind of wrap that one up, I’ll be looking at a place that is running a cash flow. I think that’s important. Don’t feel like you need to be stuck locally. Yeah, you might. If you’re if it’s your first one, I think it’s a great opportunity for you to learn how that all works. But through joint venture partners and connecting with people, you are able to invest anywhere across the country. I mean, you don’t even have to invest in Canada if you have partners in other countries. So even if you can’t afford a home with the crazy stress test or something like multifamily, you can overcome that hurdle. So with the right insight, you can do it. I know Sandy, you were telling me about how you were able to do wholesaling and use the money. I mean, there’s a lot of creative ways you can use to get in the market. I think that still is the case now when it comes to buying your home. Honestly, I think when I view someone living there, unless it’s a multi-family, I don’t view that as an investment. I’ve never really viewed your home as an investment. So like, I had one person I was speaking with last week there they had a family member buying a condo in Toronto, and they said the house it’s listed for, I don’t know, 650, and we think it’s going to go over seven. And they said, how much? How much should we pay for it? And I said, I don’t know how much you want it, because if you’re if you’re looking at that condo as an investment, if you want to invest in real estate, I would not be buying a condo in the city. The reason you’re buying a condo city is because that’s where you want to live, which is fine. So if you overpay $50000, I mean, in their case, they’re paying cash. So who cares? The value will eventually be there. You’re buying a lifestyle; you’re not buying an investment. So that’s why I would kind of break it up into the two. The two categories
Sandy Mackay [00:39:55] makes sense, makes sense. That’s I think, good insight for where we’re at in the market because there’s so many people with questions about if they should be doing anything right now or they should be sitting on the fence or where they should be putting their funds because it’s a tough market to get into. Whether you’re investing or you’re looking for your first home. It’s a tough one to crack right now, almost anywhere in Ontario and or Canada, probably for that matter.
Bradley Watson [00:40:19] And you know, the tough market government intervention, I mean, it’s very easy to stay in this market. Prices are going up. Rents outside the city are going up. I mean, the city, I think, are going to start going up again to the problem right now with qualifying is things like land transfer taxes and the stress test an unbelievable hurdle for people to overcome. I mean, if I got to qualify over four and a half percent, but yet my mortgage is 1.7. Like, I understand that that’s designed to protect us, but that’s a little over the top right. Like that’s a very difficult. And not to mention people that are self-employed, right? Like, you got a difficult time like this. People don’t necessarily work for an employer. Maybe they’re working as a virtual assistant. Self-employed income is not treated favorably when it comes to qualifying. So these restrictions and regulations, I believe, is what’s created the hurdle to market. It’s and naturally inflated price. At the same time, it’s a double whammy. It really is, I think, for the city. People need to be OK when it comes to affordability with renting. They don’t need to necessarily own, and I believe everybody should own. I do believe that. But our city is going in such a direction that renting should also be important, like the main priority should be housing, that people have a place with a roof over their head. Not that people can afford to buy a house. And I think we I’m OK with that. I’ve come to be OK with that. But a lot of people feel a right or it’s their right as a Canadian to own real estate, and it’s not built that way anymore. It’s really not all right.
Sandy Mackay [00:41:53] If you go to work and try to go rent there and buy in Windsor or somewhere else where whenever you don’t, you don’t need to own and live in the same property you own necessarily. I’ve done that at times. I’ve owned like I’ve been renting and owned, probably a dozen or more places and paying rents for my personal place. I’ve done that for a couple of years, at least in life, and I don’t know what’s wrong with that. You’re still the whole point of the buying real estate. Aside from your whole primary home is just an investment purpose like your primary residence is totally different, different animal, right? So I agree with you for the most part there that that makes sense,
Rob Break [00:42:32] but I’m stealing this from another podcaster. But I remember early on, like when I was listening for information. I remember Jason Hartman. I don’t know if you’ve ever heard of him, but his big thing that he always said was invest in market. That makes sense. So you can afford to live in the markets that don’t love it.
Bradley Watson [00:42:53] Hang on, hang on. I mean, especially in a place like Ontario. I mean, the laws are so in your favor. It’s disgusting, it’s disgusting. I mean, this is why for people who are investing, I would encourage them to look out of province for that reason alone. And I think a lot of people have recognized that. And it’s also led to spinoff consequences in other provinces. Mean we saw in Nova Scotia apply massive rules in protection of the tenants. So that that was a result of Toronto investors running like people are looking like crazy at New Brunswick right now. It’d be very interesting to see if New Brunswick pulls the plug on it like Nova Scotia did, because people are running away from here, but also to their because they recognize the opportunities. And so if you live here as a tenant, that’s in your favor. I mean, you got there is they’ve set a mandate this year that you cannot increase your rent across the province. Now, of course, people are taking advantage and landlords bigger landlords do tend to screw the little guys are the ones statistically doing that. But all that to say you still have a ton of rights and protections right now in Ontario that a lot of other provinces don’t even see.
Rob Break [00:44:00] Well, now we’ve sort of skimmed over it a little bit, but let’s talk about your podcast. Tell us a little bit about it. When how long have you been doing it? What’s it called and where can people hear it?
Bradley Watson [00:44:11] Yeah, so a podcast called Toronto’s Number One Real Estate Podcast started it last February 2020, right before COVID hit. We started uploading all of our some of our YouTube content that we had at the time because I’ve been doing YouTube for a few years before that. And then when COVID happened, I’m like, OK, what happens if you do a podcast every single day for a month? And I did that for a month realized, damn, this could work. I did it several more months now. Since then, I’ve scaled back. We are on just over a month, over a year, and we’ve got over 200 episodes, so we’re averaging about 17 per month since starting. But a lot of that was front loaded, and the podcast is very much about the market keeping up with what’s going on in the news, some of the same articles you read, people are working, professionals are running around. They don’t have time to decipher all of these things. And so show is very much geared towards getting you all the headlines, giving a little bit of a spin with a bit of humor. Sometimes I try to be funny and fail miserably, and at the same time, we also bring on awesome guests once a week. And that is another aspect where people they want to know the market. But the reason is because they want to make money in real estate. So we talk to people that are able to do that to you. So we have a lot of fun. Have a fantastic community. The views are different. I mean, on YouTube, you can go viral, and I’ve gone viral. But I find that on podcast, it’s more of a community. It’s relationship, it’s trust. There they are. I mean, I’m so thankful people give hours of their attention to listening to what you have to say. And so that almost leads to a sense of responsibility to offer them your best. I mean, any given podcast that I do now, though there’s fewer of them, takes about three to four hours to produce the ones that I do. And then with guests also, there’s a level of preparation and bringing on the best guests. So we’re having a lot of fun. I’m not doing it for any specific reason, but there’s obvious reasons that there’s obvious opportunities that have come from doing it. And the biggest is that I’ve learned so much and I’m just so thankful to have a platform that’s even on any level similar to what you guys have been doing. You guys have put in so much work and have built this incredible platform, so to even be considered anywhere in there is awesome and I’m thankful for it.
Rob Break [00:46:18] So and where can people hear it?
Bradley Watson [00:46:21] You find us on iTunes, Spotify. If you look up trying to real estate, we’re right there. I just look for my pretty face. And on YouTube, you can find me at Watson Estates as well.
Rob Break [00:46:29] Watson Estates. Got it. OK, let’s talk about what’s next for you. What you what are your big plans going forward here?
Bradley Watson [00:46:37] Yeah. So right now I’m trying to I’ve got I know what I want to do. I’m trying to build, I guess, a foundation. I’m trying. So a lot of this has come with tons of great relationships and contacts. So I’ve got right now, I’m in this bit of a juggling act where I’ve got so many off market, so many really great opportunities coming from one angle. And I’ve got so many different investors coming from the other angle and trying to be able to match, make them figure out who I want to work with. What are their investment goals and then being able to make those connections? But also, though, there’s a thousand deals coming out, I mean, being able to identify which are the few that are worth putting in the amount of time. I mean, I don’t know about you guys, but I can get caught looking at a deal and it could take away the better half of a day. Like, I’ll just be so in love with looking and analyzing that deal. And then you make a quick phone call. All of a sudden, it’s like, OK, now you know, this is not actually worth it, and there’s a lot of wasted time. So being able to streamline that process, I think, is what’s next for me and being able to figure out like, how do I prioritize the time? Because time is the most valuable currency, especially when our currency is not very valuable.
Sandy Mackay [00:47:48] So although time again, creating wealth to free up more time up the wealth of everyone wants them, and that’s the whole reason to build wealth, I think, I think for everybody is to free up your time so you can do whatever the heck you want to do in life, right? Absolutely. What else Amos words or what, I guess? You know, it’s pretty exciting to see you. You’ve got a great show. I want to make sure people go check it out because you do have some great resources in terms of stats and data and stuff. They’re there talking about it in the market, which is exciting and it’s something that you touched on here today. But I’m sure they can get a heck of a lot more details and more up-to-date, timely info if they’re checking out your show. So definitely want to encourage people to go check it out and reach out to you for more Rob any last words before we wrap up?
Rob Break [00:48:29] I mean, I don’t want to put you on the spot, but one of the things that I really like to hear from people is sort of like the one piece of information or advice that they’ve gotten. You know that they remember from the past. It’s always stuck with them and help them, you know, because most people do have that light bulb moment in some way, just to that point where something clicked and they got it, you know? So I don’t know if you have anything like that.
Bradley Watson [00:48:52] There’s a bunch of them, I’d say on the topic of the podcast and what we’re kind of discussing today. I think the secret sauce is consistency, you know, like it takes a lot of work. The concepts are very simple, you know, share on any platform as much as you possibly can consistently because as soon as you’re a move that consistency, you can’t pull these things off. I mean, I can send I can say, I’m going to send it off market deals and then I stop. There goes, you know, whether people are relying on you or not. I mean, it might feel like it’s like the hockey stick analogy, right? Like, you’re putting in all this work and things are just about to launch. And the consistency and consistency also doesn’t just come at the beginning, but it comes along the line with that. When you start getting that momentum, it sometimes feels like, oh, I’m good, you can pull back. But anytime I’ve done that is come with a lot of heartbreak and having to do a reset. So I’m very much about keeping that momentum moving again through this consistency. So I’m not going to say that’s the only life changing lesson I have, but there is not a lot of people that can do that these days. People are very they love shiny things and they’ll run in all different directions, and they don’t realize how much it’s wasting their own time. It’s easy to have ideas, but you’ve got to apply it and do it where everyone else stops. You got to show up day and night. Yeah, you’re tired. We’re all tired. But if you want to build something of value, you’ve got to keep serving as much as you can.
Rob Break [00:50:19] That’s great. Yeah, I agree. 100 percent. And you got to keep filling that, that pipeline, right? Keep filling the funnel. Yeah, absolutely.
Bradley Watson [00:50:29] And have fun doing it, man. I mean, there’s no we would not be doing this if we didn’t love it. And people feel that people know you’re actually having fun. I mean, half the reason I put the jokes in my podcast because I do put a lot of really awesome jokes in my show, but it’s because I like to have fun and it’s like I specifically spend time making sure there’s humor in there, because if I’m going to do this, I don’t want to be the same voice and I’ve got a lot of flak. People are like, oh, you’re a realtor or you’re not professional, but don’t listen to my show. I didn’t force you in the room. So have fun doing it. You know it makes it easier.
Sandy Mackay [00:51:06] Awesome. I love that. A lot of advice that goes with so many things in life, business or investment, for sure. Just the consistency and showing up. You don’t have to show up every single day, but when you show up, just this keeps you on up, right? As much as possible. And time over time, that consistency will compound, and you’ll create something cool. It’s inevitable.
Rob Break [00:51:26] So how? First of all, let’s say who should be getting in touch with you?
Bradley Watson [00:51:31] Who should be getting in touch with me? Well, I would say if you’re looking to invest in money and you want to figure out how that works. Give me a call. I’m available. I know it’s like always this big guy on this big podcast. I got a couple of kids. I put pants on in the morning. Just like everybody else, I’m available. I mean, having the conversations with people is really kind of the reason you do it because it’s all about relationships, all about connecting. So I guess so from that angle, if you need support, even if it’s not me, reach out to somebody and get that support, you know? And but also if someone does have off market deals, they’re looking for capital across Canada even and they’ve got a home run opportunity, just a phone call away. Give us a call or we’re happy to chat business and see if there is a way for us to make that contact and otherwise no strings attached. Just keep learning, connect to the podcast and learn what take what you’re going to take and leave what you don’t want. And I think that I’m OK with that. I’m not using the podcast as a platform to build wealth because we’re already doing that. It’s more for the audience.
Rob Break [00:52:36] Awesome. I’m sure those people are listening. So now tell them what the best way is to get in touch with you.
Bradley Watson [00:52:43] Yeah, you can reach out to me. I mean, you can leave us a review if. You want to just leave us a review, I mean, we’re always accepting those on iTunes, it helps channel, but they can send me a message on Instagram, not watch in the states. They can leave a comment on the YouTube videos that we post out lots in the states. So or my honestly, my cell phone’s all over the world. So I’m a very easy person to find if you look my name up because I want to be available for people and so just Google me.
Rob Break [00:53:08] Bradley Watson, Bradley Watson. Got it. OK. And all Bradley’s info is going to be in the show, notes, guys, so you’ll be able to contact them whenever you want. Click on over into the show notes and you can leave comments there too and ask questions. Ask questions any questions you have for Bradley? You know, you can put them in there as well, and we’ll get back to them and make sure that everybody sees all your questions can be answered. Well, thanks, Bradley. Really appreciate you coming on today. I mean, you shared a ton of market insights, I think which was pretty interesting. And hopefully people got a lot out of that. And yeah, just thanks again for being here.
Bradley Watson [00:53:46] Yeah. Sandy Rob. Appreciate it. You guys keep doing what you’re doing with the fantastic content and guests, and I really do appreciate you. Allow me a chance to come on and share a few thoughts.
Rob Break [00:53:58] Sandy, how can people get in touch with you?
Sandy Mackay [00:54:01] Two nine three eight nine six eight four six or Sandy MacKay Realty Network Accounts.
Rob Break [00:54:06] And, you know, you can just look Sandy up to if you if you miss that and this look Sandy up as well, you know, we’re pretty easy to get all over the place.
Sandy Mackay [00:54:14] We’re all realtors. We’re not hard to find.
Rob Break [00:54:16] But if you want to reach me, you can get me at Rob at Mr. Breakthrough Dot S.A. OK, guys, thanks again for listening. And everyone have a wonderful day. Excellent. Now.