Dave Debeau [00:00:09] Everyone is Dave Debeau here with another episode of the Property Profits Real Estate podcast today, zooming in all the way from beautiful Fort Worth, Texas, Max Keller. How are you doing today, Max? Doing great. How are you, sir? I'm fantastic. So if you look behind, you're watching this on video, you're looking behind Max. You're seeing a beautiful bookshelf with some beautiful books on that. That's what we're going to be really focusing on here today, because Max is not only a real estate entrepreneur, an ex math teacher, which I find particularly intimidating, Max, because that was one of my worst subjects in school. So hopefully we won't be getting any any math stuff here except the fun one when it comes to profits. But Max is a real estate entrepreneur and he's really dialed it in for how to use books as a sales and a marketing tool for us as real estate entrepreneurs. And we're going to really be talking about how to apply this for attracting motivated sellers. So, Max, looking forward to that. First thing's first. We won't get too far into your background about stuff, but how did you kind of stumble across this whole idea of using a book for finding motivated sellers?
Max Keller [00:01:22] Yeah. So my strategy, how I found it was really sort of born out of necessity. So I was a math teacher for seven years, got into real estate, started out just part time, then went to full time and flipped a lot of homes in the first two and a half years, nearly one hundred homes. And so I felt really good about where I was at with my deal flow and my business. The problem was I was just constantly interviewing for more deals and the other leads were getting tighter. I'm in the Dallas Fort Worth area and so there's more competition. There's more just skinnier margins. So I had to find a better way to get leads. I mean, I was doing pretty much what everybody else was doing, yellow letters, postcards, websites, bandit signs. And it just just wasn't working. There was people who are willing to pay more. So step one is I went through a list of the deals that I'd already done and figured out which ones had the most profit, which deals. It was easy to work with the seller and I had fun. So I was all want to make money and have fun at the same time. So my niche that I found the on my list of deals was senior homeowners and senior homeowners. For me, it made a lot of sense, really, because these folks needed a lot of different kinds of help. So step one for me to use a book was just to find my own niche. And once I found a niche that really worked for me and had a lot of advantages, then I actually got the idea from one of my sellers. So I didn't just think it up. It was sort of what I was noticing was, is that with my senior homeowners, they needed a lot of different kinds of help. And so if I could learn more information about the different things that they needed, like senior housing, referrals to different health care providers, things like that, referrals to attorneys, there's just like a lot going on at once. So what I was doing was I was I was learning more and just adding more value to the transaction. And so one of my motivated sellers is actually the adult daughter. She was like, you know, in our 50. She said, you know, you've helped our family out a ton. I bought their house and then I helped their parents find somewhere else to live. And they said, you know, you should write a book about this. And I was like, no, I'm a house buyer, math teacher, not a writer. But then I thought about it and I was like, you know, it's actually a pretty good idea. I could go from the guy at that point. They've been about a year. I'd really established myself in the niche of the guy who knew a lot about senior homeowners. But I could make the pivot from the person who knew a lot about it to the person who wrote the book on it. So that's what I did. I wrote my first book and it was just a pretty simple process. We made it even simpler for your viewers. I've got a free gift at the end for everybody's listening. But I just made a list of all the questions that I was getting asked over and over in living rooms and what the answers were, the pros and cons, and made my first outline, expanded it and wrote my first book is called Home The Home The Step by Step Senior Housing Guide. And then I create a workbook to go with it. I printed out one hundred copies of it and I started just giving it away as my business card and I got some benefits from that that will go into later that I was just not expecting. And it really transformed the way that I do marketing for my home or business.
Dave Debeau [00:04:39] That is so cool. So interesting. Interesting. So your book title wasn't all about, Hey, how I can buy your house fast. It was really about what the big benefit is, the benefits and the the steps along the way for your ideal prospective home seller, these senior people or their adult children that are trying to help them move from their house into a senior. Facility or something like that, and you're really helping them along the way. So help us fill in the blanks. And then I like to say a book, as you've alluded to, is is like a business card on steroids. So how do you go from having this book and having this workbook to getting people requesting that? Or were you just kind of when you're doing your normal marketing, where you offering this book as a way to get your foot in the door? How did that part of the whole equation work for you, Max?
Max Keller [00:05:35] Yeah, great question. So at first I just started it as just a way to give it out to people as my business card. And then what happened was it started to become I like number one referral tool. So I started passing out a lot of these. And what I was noticing is, you know, business cards and yellow letters and post cards. I would spend thousands and thousands a month on all those things. But if people people didn't request them, they just throw them away. But I was noticing people weren't throwing away my book. So instead of being in the junk, paying tens of thousands of dollars to be with the junk mail, I was on the coffee table with all the other autograph books from the author. So I was nobody none of my competition had a book know. A lot of people think, well, Max, you know, I'm not a writer. I mean, how am I supposed to write a book? And it's like, well, you know, if you're thinking that great news, you know, a lot of your competition is, too. We've come up with a couple of ways to make it easier than ever. We have there's kind of two routes that you can go, but and we'll talk about that later if we have time. But the bottom line is, is that I first just started getting all these phone calls from people. I didn't know who they were and they said, we got a copy of your book. And I'm like thinking I've never given it to him. So what happened was it's just sort of common sense. You know, if you have a book from a local author and it's about this particular topic, mine was about all the challenges seniors in their families face. If you know somebody at church or at the grocery store or one of your friends that's going through the same problem, you just got to give it to them and say, hey, I know the guy who wrote the book on this, so my books start getting passed around. Another thing that happened was I started getting just like really presold before I'd walk in the door. So the first like I had no idea how to market with a book when I started doing this. I've had to learn all of this through a lot of trial and error. Now we have students all over the nation that use this and plug into our licensed content. But I had to figure this out on my own. So when I first went to Baycol, when I go by the house, I brought my book and the senior home, I was like, we got a book and they just wanted to read the book. They don't want to talk to me. They thought it was so cool. They got this book. So then what we start doing is that when people call us, we go, Oh, you got a copy of our book yet? And if they haven't, you know, and it's a seller's market and they're thinking before they maybe if they don't know us, hey, you know, you and a million other people are going to come and look at the house and we're just going to have an auction because that's pretty much how it goes in some of these really competitive markets. You know that the seller thinks that they've got the cheese and they're getting all these postcards so they know that people want what they have. And so if you want what I have, you've got to pay me for it. And so what we did is we totally flipped it. We said so when people call us and they're like, yeah, come over right now, it's like, no, we don't do that. Have you got a copy of our book? It sounds like you don't know who we are. And they're like, Oh, your book. Your book. Oh, yeah. OK, check out. We wrote the step by step senior housing guide, but chapter three is just all the way to sell your home. Pros and cons of each. You don't have to be a senior to get take advantage of that. So here's our process. I'll send you a copy of the book. I'm going to autograph it. I wrote it and then if I send it over to you, can you read Chapter three before I come over here? And then what happens is, is that now they're not calling other people because they're really intrigued by what's going on. The people that they already call before us, they tell them not to come over because why would they work with anybody else when they already have the person who wrote the book on the subject?
Dave Debeau [00:08:50] And what's really smart about what you're saying here, Max, is you're not you're not tell them, hey, read the whole book before I come over. It's read chapter three. That's doable. That's that's a bite sized chunk. Yeah. Trying to get them to read the whole damn thing. That's that might be asking a little bit too much. So how are you getting the books in there and how are you. Because you want to do that fast. You want to strike while the while the iron's hot, so to speak. So what are you doing to get that book in their hand? Are you sent in by mail, center by courier? What are you doing?
Max Keller [00:09:20] Yeah, so we do a lot of things. So if somebody calls us and they want to get help with selling their house, well, then we just autograph it and send it via courier so they get it like right. Then, you know, I mean, it costs me a few bucks, but it's by far worth it when I'm walking into appointment and I'm already presold. I'm not interviewing they. They know me. They've already invested. You know, it's like when you tell a kid, don't look over there and then they look over there when I say only read Chapter three, a lot of times these are folks who maybe aren't traditionally major readers. They're reading the whole book because they're really interested in what's going on. This guy who wrote it's coming over to my house. I've never had that happen before. And so they've they've already invested three, four or five hours with me before I come over when I'm not even there. So now I'm not in a. Going for a job or singing for my supper and reeking of desperation, I'm the local expert authority and celebrity and we're taking selfies before we cross the threshold. And now it's just about our process and going through it. And so it's just a lot more fun. And I will tell you, we have people who call and said, hey, I read the book and I'm actually that read Chapter four, how to stay in my house. I think I want to just stay put for a little while. And so it avoids us going over to people's homes when it's not necessary, because I'm sure folks can relate to that. But even better and we go over there most of the time it's just us and it's they already know like and trust us from the book. And so it's just it's just a way easier way to buy houses.
Dave Debeau [00:10:47] Very cool, Max. That brings another question to mind for me, I got a bunch of them, so the first one that comes to mind is, do you actually use the book itself as a lead generator? So right now, you're talking about, you know, if somebody replies to some of your other marketing, asked them, oh, by the way, do you have the book now? OK. Is there a way that you use the book itself as a way to get people to, you know, good prequalified perspective, how sellers to put up their hat?
Max Keller [00:11:15] Yeah, great question. Yeah. So actually that's one of the other benefits from a book that I was not expecting. So I had my book out for a little while and then I got a random phone call from a local church and they had gotten a copy of my book from somebody who goes to that church. And the pastor called me and said, Hey, I love this book. I love what you're doing. These are questions people are asking us and I don't know the answer to those. Can you come in and speak to our congregation? And I was like, sure. I mean, I didn't have anything prepared. I didn't have any fancy slides. I basically just brought a box of my books and myself and I just got out of the book and I had about twenty five thirty people there and they had the books and they were just there, all homeowners. And there were so engaged and they're really just hanging on every word at the end. They were really appreciative. They came up and thanked me. We did some book signings, a couple of them actually booked appointments with me to go look at their houses, which was great. And so although it was just a local church group, I mean, it felt to me like a TED talk and it was really cool because instead of just being the one homeowner driving to their house, speaking with one homeowner at a time and seeing if they choose me, I had the opportunity to do that with twenty five or thirty homeowners all at the same time. And so that's been a method that that we and our students replicate is those business to business relationships. So the homeowners face a lot of people are just they're thinking B2C. So we're buying lists, we're stacking lists, we're texting people. The common theme and marketing right now is just send people a bunch of stuff that they don't want. And instead what we do is position ourselves as the local experts. I'll give you another example. I spoke at our local county's probate attorney association. So do you think that 30 probate attorneys in a room where I'm standing up as a trusted expert, do you think they may know people who need to sell their home?
Dave Debeau [00:13:03] Every single one of them knows a bunch of them.
Max Keller [00:13:05] Yeah, exactly. So those are the kind of ways that we partner with different depending on what niche we're going after. There's different folks that we can reach out to and the business side and then speak to groups live and now, you know, virtually like we're doing right now. So there are some ways to help generate leads that way. That's I've never done before until I had a book.
Dave Debeau [00:13:25] So, Max, people are probably thinking about this, and I really like to connect the dots for folks as much as possible. So if somebody is listening to this, sounds good for Max. He's really focusing on seniors trying to get out of their house and he wants to get their properties and flip them and that kind of stuff. But I don't do that. How would a book work for me if I'm if I'm focusing on the bird strategy? I'm trying to find this kind of I'm trying to find multifamily deals or something like that. So I know you've got a whole company around helping people. Real estate investors write books. How does it work in other niches like you like that?
Max Keller [00:14:03] Yeah, great question. So, you know, there's really kind of two ways to go when it comes to a book. First of all, if you if somebody has to say yes or no in order for you to complete their transaction and for them to say yes or no to you, there's some type of educational piece around it, something that that they're having to decide. It might be complicated than using a book could be something that is beneficial. We have two ways that our company that we help people and it's really like the two types of investors. So I call them the DIY and the ROIC. So the DIY investor, maybe a one man or girl show they'd like to roll up their sleeves and get everything done and are very hands on. And, you know, that takes a little bit longer to get the ROIC that way. There's a little less leverage, a little more trial and error. But if folks like doing that, there's nothing wrong with it. So we've created the first of its kind. It's called the Real Estate Investor Book Writing Checklist. And in the book is, I'm sure at the end, a way that your audience get a free copy of it. We sell them for twelve ninety nine, but you can get a free copy. We have just a limited number that we're going to give away.
Dave Debeau [00:15:09] I let them know now because we've got to wrap up here pretty quick.
Max Keller [00:15:12] Yes. Deals chasing you so deals chasing you, dotcom slash Dave. Nice. And so if you go to that site you can it really breaks down how to write your own book. And it's a lot of the things I wish I knew when I started. It would have saved me about half the time. And then folks who are more on the ROIC side and they leverage a team and they just want to time is money. We have some different niches, license content that folks can plug into so they don't have to write it all themselves.
Dave Debeau [00:15:41] Very cool. Very cool. Max, this is this is a lot of fun, my friend. So. Yeah. Thank you very much for sharing your your insights. I love it. I love how you kind of stumbled across this whole book writing thing and now you've used it yourself with great success and you're helping other people use it as well. And again, if people want to get in touch with you or get started with your world, the best way to do that is what's the website again?
Max Keller [00:16:06] Good deals chasing you. Dotcom forgave and you can get a copy of the check list. And then we have some free videos on our website that you can check out to understand what we're doing. It's a little bit different. And what I like about that is we're able to get different and I think a lot better results.
Dave Debeau [00:16:24] Very good, Max. Thank you very much, my friend. It's been nice chatting with you today. Yeah, you too. Talk soon. Take care. All right, everybody, on the next episode. Bye bye. Well, hey there. Thanks for tuning into the property profits podcast. If you like this episode, that's great. Please go ahead and subscribe on iTunes. Give us a good review. That would be awesome. I appreciate that. And if you're looking to attract investors and raise capital for your deals, that may invite you to get a complimentary copy of my newest book right back there. There it is, the money partner formula. You get a PDF version at investor attraction book, dot com again, investor attraction book, dot com ticker.