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EPISODE 9: FIX AND FLIP THE PROFITABLE WAY WITH FIDAN “FRANK” GENESKI

EPISODE 9 FIX AND FLIP THE PROFITABLE WAY WITH FIDAN “FRANK” GENESKI
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Table of Contents - EPISODE 9: FIX AND FLIP THE PROFITABLE WAY WITH FIDAN “FRANK” GENESKI

Podcast Transcription

Rob Break [00:00:03] Hey Sandy. Hey, Rob, what's that you're reading? Oh, this it's the new book by award winning real estate investor Quentin D'Souza. The property management toolbox is all of the tools and systems for starting out as a new landlord and all of the resources to create less stress while expanding your rental portfolio. It is awesome.

Sandy MacKay [00:00:24] Wow, that sounds amazing. Where can I get one?

Rob Break [00:00:28] Just go to w w w dot the Ontario landlord toolbox, dot dotcom.

Sandy MacKay [00:00:38] The property management toolbox, a how to guide for Ontario real estate investors and landlords. I'm going to order my copy right now. Break through real estate investing podcast Episode nine.

Rob Break [00:01:14] Hello and welcome to the Breakthrough Real Estate Investing podcast, we put this show together to inspire you and help you live the life that you want to live through the power of real estate investing. My name is Rob Break and here with me again is Sydney Mackay. How's it going, Sandy?

Sandy MacKay [00:01:31] Rob, it's going really good, really pumped up about this. So it's always got a great guest with us here today, a buddy of ours. And I really pumped up about this one.

Rob Break [00:01:41] Yeah. Frank, this is a good friend and very successful fix and flip investor in the area. I was really excited to have him on. It was a great interview and it's coming up very soon. But I guess we're going to talk about a few things here. First, if you have a question or comment or would like to write a little review for us or even leave a rating, you can do all that at iTunes. And you can also leave a comment at Breakthru ARIA podcast, s.A.

Sandy MacKay [00:02:09] Yeah, I'd love to hear your guy's feedback and certainly welcome any questions, comments, and we'll bring it up on the show, too, if we if we get some good questions so far.

Rob Break [00:02:20] And we have, I think, a really, really valuable free gift to give away, don't we, over there, Sandy?

Sandy MacKay [00:02:26] For sure. Yeah. Good reminder there. We got to invite everyone to go download our free report, The Seven Freedom Activators. But you can trigger in your property right now something that's going to help you, any investor out there with investing in real estate and just the simple ways to make your life a lot easier and more profitable.

Rob Break [00:02:46] A ton of awesome free information in that guide, yeah, we're giving it away for free, so go over there. Breakthru Aria podcast Zeya.

Sandy MacKay [00:02:55] Yeah, we'll get that and we've got a couple things to share before we get to interview, I guess doing

Rob Break [00:03:02] you're just going to discuss a few things going on with us. And I know you've got a fairly big announcement to make. Want to tell us a bit about that?

Sandy MacKay [00:03:12] Well, yeah, it's big for me. I don't know if people are going to be too excited about it yet, but I'm I'm a realtor now with Keller Williams real estate, so that's pretty exciting for me. It's been a long time coming something, you know, I've been working hard and it's a bit of a process getting licensed and all that. But I'm really excited to be working alongside a guy many of our listeners will probably know of because he's written two pretty successful books about Canadian real estate investing. He's written The Fix and Flip the Canadian How to Guide for Buying, Renovating and Selling Property for Fast Profit. And I coauthored that with another one of our buddies in Zabo. And I wrote another book called Investing in Rental Property A Complete Guide for Canadian Real Estate Investors. And and his name is Mark Loffler. So we have been working with him lately and I actually joined his team. A new team is putting together. So we're known as the Ontario Property Pros Team. And it's been really exciting to work with a guy like that, basically having them kind of as a mentor for me as a realtor. So, yeah, really excited to be doing that. And we're, you know, right now focusing mostly in Hamilton. So it's cool. It's it's really exciting.

Rob Break [00:04:27] I think it was a great move for me. And I'm really, really happy that things are working out over there. I know they're going really well for you, so I wish you all the best success. And I know this even involves a move moving up to that area from where you are now.

Sandy MacKay [00:04:42] Yeah. Yeah, it is a big decision because we are we're sitting here moving out that way. We're a little bit too far to be driving that all the time. You know, we want to live in the area that we're going to be working in and investing our time and everything in. And so, yeah, we decided we're moving over there pretty soon. And yeah, it's really fun because we're we're actually working mostly with investors, which is which is really the the main reason that I went that way. You know, I didn't want to just become a realtor, to be a realtor. I wanted to do it in a way that's going to also help me grow as an investor. Yeah, that's.

Rob Break [00:05:19] And you were telling me about some of the systems that he has in place and some of the marketing that he does. It sounds really, really cool and innovative, not generally the way that most were real estate agents go about things. So it sounds like a really cool opportunity. And I know he's looking to expand, but I believe he's looking to expand in a big way. And, you know, it's pretty cool that you're getting in there right on the ground floor.

Sandy MacKay [00:05:43] Yeah. You know, we'll we'll have him on here on the show at some point for sure. And actually, we've already both we both did a talk with him a few months back there at the Durham Real Estate Investors meeting in Whitby. So we both chatted with him about it before. But, you know, we'll have him on here again and do a show with him because he's definitely got a lot of great stuff to share.

Rob Break [00:06:06] Yeah, very successful real estate investor.

Sandy MacKay [00:06:08] Yeah. And, you know, we've we're on our ninth episode here. And there's just there's we sat down last week, right. And we made a little less than we realize. There's so many great people we got to have on. And he's certainly one that we that we plan to have on here in the near future.

Rob Break [00:06:24] Absolutely.

Sandy MacKay [00:06:26] So what have you been up to, Rob?

Rob Break [00:06:28] Let's hear something. Some news? Well, I mean, I've I've been doing a whole bunch of stuff, but one thing that sort of sticks out to me right now is looking at purchasing a property to do a flip. And Ajax and I've been working on this for probably a good two months. I mean, I know you and I have talked about it, wouldn't it? It's probably been two months,

Sandy MacKay [00:06:51] I think even longer. Maybe it might

Rob Break [00:06:52] it might even be longer. I have to look at how the look back on my notes. So now we actually have a signed purchase agreement. But the problem is that the the woman who's living in the place right now, how to rent to own contract with the owner of the property. And there has been all kinds of issues with the place while she's been living there. So it's gone to the landlord tenant board. So there's a lot of issues to work through here in order to get the ball rolling. But we just this is something that our guest is going to mention. You know, you just jump in some other good advices. You just if you're driving in the fog, then you can still get to where you're going. You just have to drive a little bit slower. So that's kind of what we're doing right now. Just taking it one step at a time. And we know where we're going. We know what the plan is, but it looks like it's going to be a lot quite the process to get us there.

Sandy MacKay [00:07:52] Cool. And so so what's going to be the outcome of. You know, what's what's the goal at this place?

Rob Break [00:07:59] Well, I know basically he just wants because it's crazy. OK, so this this woman is living in there, has basically gotten a rental contract with this guy at a certain price. And she's also negotiated somehow the guy. So the seller is. Not very savvy and. She has negotiated this rental contract where one hundred percent of her rent goes towards the deposit of the house and there's no appreciation worked into the price. As a matter of fact, she is is claiming that he needs to lower the price because the value of the property is depreciated by. I believe her number is twenty eight thousand dollars that she's trying to get the board to. And I've spoken with this woman. She's saying that she has a way of trying to get the seller to sell with depreciation taken into account. I'm kind of on the outside looking in until we're able to legally close on this place. But this is a real interesting process that we're going through right now. And they had a hearing today, actually, and the outcome of that was her suits that she had against the owner have been thrown out. So that was good news. I was very, very excited to hear about that. It's a win either way. This is the I talked him into getting a paralegal. Where he was going to represent himself, I'd spoken with his lawyer and his lawyer said, look, this guy cannot represent himself, he needs somebody in there to help him. So I did talk him into getting a paralegal. That was probably the best thing for him. So, yeah, the outcome of that was that her case was thrown out. So that was really good news. And now we can move on to the next step

Sandy MacKay [00:09:53] in some of these deals that you try and get as private deals, especially if they can be tricky sometimes when the process can take a long time. I know one deal we that Kate and I were working on at one point that we ended up wholesaling took us, you know, five, six months from, you know, first point of contact to eventually putting pen to paper and doing a deal and.

Rob Break [00:10:17] And how much do you learn in there?

Sandy MacKay [00:10:19] Oh, yeah, tons. You know,

Rob Break [00:10:22] well, that's just it. Like people might have had people ask me why I'm wasting my time right now, but I mean. I know that the outcome is going to be a deal on this one, and it may be taking me a lot of time and effort, but you know what? This guy needed help. He really did. This woman this woman was really taking advantage of him, as far as I could tell so far. So that's usually the other way around. It's usually all the big bad landlord is taking advantage of the tenant. But in this particular case, having just having just heard that the case was thrown out, well, it shows you that it's not always the case.

Sandy MacKay [00:11:03] So, yeah, crazy stuff. You know, the stuff you see out there is really wild sometimes. So. So we're going to talk about this probably next episode, too. Might have a conclusion to it, right?

Rob Break [00:11:14] Yeah, I'm hoping I do. I'd really like to I'd really like to have the deal closed by then. So, yeah. Let's I'll keep it. I'll keep you posted.

Sandy MacKay [00:11:23] Yeah. Perfect. So it's about time we get into our interview here with our guest, Frank Genachowski, and he's got some really great stuff to share with us. He's going to tell you how to fix and flip real estate full time. And he's also going to tell you why, as an investor, you should or should not get your realtor license. And there's a lot of benefits to both sides of that, I think. And he's also going to be part of our new segment called The Realtor Joke of the Day. And and, yeah, we'll see if that sticks or not. But we've got a couple of jokes in there for you today. I thoroughly enjoyed it. It was pretty good. OK, so that's all coming your way here in our interview with Frank Georgescu. Here it is.

Rob Break [00:12:10] I am very happy to introduce our guest today, my friend and successful fix and flip investor and also rookie agent of the year with Right at Home Realty Fidan Genachowski. But I know him as Frank. So welcome, Frank, and thanks for being on the show tonight.

Frank Geneski [00:12:27] Thank you for having me, Rob and Sandy, I look forward to the interview.

Rob Break [00:12:31] How are you doing?

Frank Geneski [00:12:33] I'm good. I'm good. Just like I said, looking forward to this interview. I'm kind of new to this whole question, your thing. So I think we'll have a good time.

Rob Break [00:12:43] Well, I know that from talking to you recently, that business is good, so that's always good. You've got a couple of projects on the go right now, I think.

Frank Geneski [00:12:50] W yeah, we have a few on the go. Just wrapping one up actually this week. So things are things are pretty busy, things popping up last minute and you know, trying to wrap everything up, trying to make it perfect. S easiest thing but I love doing it so it's fun time. It's a very busy time.

Rob Break [00:13:10] So do you want to tell us a little bit about you and how you got into real estate investing?

Frank Geneski [00:13:17] Sure, I get into real estate and investing. About six years ago, I bought my first duplex in Whitby and there was a legal legal duplex, which which was good to begin with because I kind of jumped on board right away. I didn't do much research as far as all the rules that a landlord tenant board rules and the regulations. So kind of jumped into that pretty quickly at the time. And right now, I'm also an active contractor and I kind of been doing that full time throughout the last six years. The last couple of years, I started doing a lot of big projects for for real estate investors like myself and you guys. And I kind of told myself, why should I be doing this for somebody else when I can kind of, you know, pick up a property myself, getting through that, rather flip it all this, you know, go derivates. So the last couple of years I've been I've been doing that and it's been going well, enjoying it quite a bit.

Rob Break [00:14:15] You know, it always surprises me that someone would because I did it would take very long for regular general contractor to realize, hey, I could be doing this for myself, but a lot of them don't. They just keep on just for other people and.

Frank Geneski [00:14:32] Most of the guys that I do talk to, like my team, I kind of mentioned to them, guys do this for yourself, you know, pick up a property and renovate it. A lot of them, you know, it's kind of beat around the bush. They there they want to do it. But it's something I don't know, I guess there may be fearful of jumping into because these guys are full time jobs. They concentrate on one trade usually, you know, electrical, plumbing or whatever it is, flooring. And then for them to get involved with, like a hole or flip, it's a little probably a little bit nerve racking. So it's is a big step. It's a big step. And I was pretty nervous to start, you know, my first one as well. It's not sure at first.

Rob Break [00:15:08] Well, I remember speaking with you a little while ago, you told me it was kind of an interesting way that you built up your initial capital to get into the game. You want to talk about that?

Frank Geneski [00:15:19] Yeah, yeah. If you're referring to online poker. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, yeah, I should have mentioned that. Yeah. I was actually a full time online poker player. That was about eight years ago. I did that for about two years prior to getting into real estate and anyone that played poker back then, I knew what they were doing. Their research made pretty good money without getting into the financial side of it, but. People made quite a bit of money, to say the least, just for playing online poker. So I did have, you know, some extra money. I was first single. I was living at home. They don't have much expenses, so I ended up saving some money, not for the whole legal duplex came into play about that. I put a nice down payment on him. You know, I was comfortable with with the mortgage payments and all the other expenses that were there. So, yeah, that was a bit of a bonus. I guess, you guys, I kind of got lucky, but yeah, that was that was a good thing.

Rob Break [00:16:21] Yeah. Said you were doing that for a while, too.

Sandy MacKay [00:16:24] Yeah. Yeah. It was pretty funny. That's how you got into. I played online for. Probably close to two years as well, a year and a half, somewhere in that range, you know, when it was the real hot, hot thing back then, it still is, I suppose, in some way. But, you know, I was thinking the other day about just the mindset of that. And it's kind of a similar mindset, I think, in terms of flipping properties like do you think there's a bit of a similarity there in terms of like how much people are willing to risk in terms of, you know, when comparing poker to maybe flip? I mean, for real estate, of course, there's a lot more be a lot more. Serve yourself, I think. Well, maybe I maybe I'm wrong in that.

Rob Break [00:17:07] Oh, I agree. Definitely. I mean, if you're if you're banking on a hand, though, I mean, I think that you're more educated in your decision making with the with the property. But I suppose it could be wrong. I don't know. I guess you could flop out pretty big time on the flip to

Frank Geneski [00:17:23] what you're saying, the similarities. You're absolutely right. Like, first of all, I noticed the risk factor a more capable of taking a bit of a risk when it comes to flip and poker like any other gamble focus. Now I have the gambling. I shouldn't say that, but poker, you got to take risks for reward. And also comes back to this thing where if you consistently make the right decisions, play first. When you play poker every single day, you could be making the right decisions for the entire month straight. And at the end, you're going to you're going to come out on top, sure. Of losing days, maybe a losing week, maybe even a losing month. But at the end of the year, if you but I said consistently make the right decision. And that goes for real estate as well. If you if you're making the right decisions as far as, you know, buying the property for a right price, good location, knowing how much your repairs are going to be going, how much you could sell for all that stuff if you put if you make right decisions. And you're going to come out on top. That's what I've learned in the last couple of years. There have been times where, you know, I broke them in real estate and there's times where I've made some decent money as well. So that's there's a lot of similarities to to the poker, poker and real estate for sure.

Sandy MacKay [00:18:35] Yeah. And also, you know, it's like the comfort factor with with taking risks, I think, to it, because you were mentioning earlier how maybe some people you work with, you, you know, they're not quite comfortable or they're nervous about taking that leap forward. Right. And I guess if you're if you've been playing poker, if you're doing things like that, we're kind of taking risks on a daily basis. It probably adds to that comfort level, right, where you can actually, you know, not as afraid to step into something and risk a bit of a bit of money knowing that you're you're doing it well educated and heavily in your favor. Right.

Frank Geneski [00:19:08] Yeah, absolutely, that's that's actually why one of the things that helped me out when I first saw it in my first flip, you know, obviously I did as much due diligence as I could. I educated myself and I felt comfortable. I'm like, OK, there is a slight chance that I could lose money on this. But I was in a position to, you know, to take this risk. Like I said at the time, now I have, I should mention of a family, of a wife. I have two kids. It would probably be a lot harder for me to to jump into it the way I did back then. Like I said back then, I was single live with my parents. I'll see that again. I had no no expenses, really. So it was a little bit easier, I guess. But still, I think, you know, if you're really interested in a you you do your research, you should you should be fine.

Sandy MacKay [00:19:53] So how do you evaluate a potential deal? What are the things that you look at?

Frank Geneski [00:19:59] Well, like as Rob said, I also am a real estate license, which I find extremely helpful, and I use it to my advantage when when evaluating ideas. Obviously I pull up comparables to Sheamus for myself when I value it to do. Obviously, the number one thing I look for is the location that makes makes a huge, huge impact on, you know, if I want to pick up the property or not. I looked at properties where I could have got them at a very low, basically a very good deal. But the neighboring houses were a disaster. So if I were to fix up the house nicely the by the potential buyers and I might not get attracted to the house or because of the neighbors, basically. So I look for a location, the number one thing. Also, what repairs need to be done with the houses are selling for afterwards, things along those lines and the basic stuff.

Rob Break [00:20:52] And when you say C.M.A, do you want to just explain what that is?

Frank Geneski [00:20:57] Well, yeah, it's a comparative market analysis. It basically states what houses in the area have sold for. What are what are they selling for, what things have been done. They can check. It's just an MLS listing and it shows, you know, how many bedrooms, washrooms, and they've been updated if basements are finished. Basically, I'm looking for all the information I can possibly get and what I plan to do to the House. So if I you know, if I decide to do a basement apartment or, you know, I look for houses that have basement apartment apartments and it so it gives you a lot of a lot of information. And I'd like to also add that someone's debating for investors, debating to get the real estate license or not. I would highly recommend it for someone that's flipping houses. Yeah, I just hope

Sandy MacKay [00:21:43] you can analyze the bill better and you can also save some money or make them pay yourself, I guess, and in ways. Right.

Rob Break [00:21:52] Well, see, I have you guys. So that's basically the same thing, except for I don't have to do all the work.

Frank Geneski [00:21:59] Yeah, that's. So a solid real estate investor, real estate agent, that's that's another way to go for sure. But they didn't really work out for me. I had a couple of guys I'm obviously not going to mention any names are actually friends of mine. Just really care to be honest with you. Didn't really care as much as I wanted them to. And I felt like that was not pushy, not annoying them, but just, you know, they just didn't have any interest. So one day I said, you know what, I think it's just a good time for me to get the license. And it's been working on night. And the only reason I got is honestly to my real estate investment side. I'm not in it to, you know, do the whole marketing and networking thing, just help out friends and family and other real estate investors. So.

Rob Break [00:22:44] Yeah, we were talking about at the beginning of the show and saying he just got his real estate license as well, too. Oh, did you know he's in the ranks?

Sandy MacKay [00:22:51] Good to go for a bit of a process. Yeah, but it's definitely I can already see the the benefits are there for sure, as particularly as an investor, it's really helpful. And just getting to know other people in the business better and things like that, it's just it's just great to be in it full time. I guess.

Rob Break [00:23:09] You know, I will say one thing for whatever reason, there are a lot of potential sellers out there who are not fond of real estate agents. And that's one of the first questions that I'm asked when when I get calls from my marketing generally. Are you a real estate agent? They want to know right away, because I'm pretty sure they're going to hang up the phone on me if I say yes. So, you know. I can see the bonuses for sure, but I mean, if you have a good real estate agent on your team is definitely someone you need on your team benefits both ways, I think. And I really debated the whole idea myself, too. But ultimately, I guess right now sort of decided to leverage my my team does. You guys.

Frank Geneski [00:23:56] Yeah. That's a good idea as to if it works for you. Anyway, I got extra mile of getting it. I guess you can debate it on me, but

Rob Break [00:24:04] yeah, there's always cons for each side I'm sure.

Frank Geneski [00:24:08] Yeah, absolutely.

Sandy MacKay [00:24:10] Yeah. And the thing about, you know, people don't like agents or whatever, is this kind of similar to any sort of salesperson or marketing type of thing out there is that there's probably a few bad apples out there that sort of ruin the outlook for most people. And certainly there are some bad realtors out there who who have probably screwed some people in the past. And that makes a lot of people pissed off and people remember that. So and you're like kind of ruined it for some of the good ethical realtors out there. But what can you do about that, I suppose?

Frank Geneski [00:24:39] Yeah, and I think that you'll find that if you're, like you said, ethical and hardworking, you're going to get you're going to get a lot of work.

Rob Break [00:24:47] So I would say when Sandy and I were putting together the overview for the show here, I had an idea of a segment I like to call the real estate agent joke of the day. But then he went in and he went and got his license, but he kind of put a stop to that.

Frank Geneski [00:25:06] Did you have one set up or. No.

Rob Break [00:25:09] Like a specific joke? Yeah, no,

Frank Geneski [00:25:16] I like to hear all the jokes.

Sandy MacKay [00:25:20] All right. Well, the next thing we were going to talk was funding. So how exactly do you how do you usually find the deals, Frank? And maybe what are some other ways that that you can potentially fund your deals?

Frank Geneski [00:25:33] OK, well, the majority of the deals that I do is just conventional funding through banks. I haven't done anything too large yet where I needed anything, you know, significant. I've sold a couple of my properties in the past. I one time I had four duplexes and would be and then thinking long term, I knew that I would need some, you know, some capital, some money to use towards Flip's. And they saw the two of my duplexes for that. I saw the other one to buy my principal residence. That's on the side. But I haven't done any to go to the creative funding. I have reached out to a couple of my family members who I've talked to about flipping, and they seemed really, really interested and they've been very supportive of that. They've helped me out in a couple of deals. But as far as you know, doing joint ventures and maybe hard money, hard money loans, I haven't gone through yet. It's just conventional loans.

Rob Break [00:26:29] Where do you find your deals?

Frank Geneski [00:26:33] Deals the most trade deals I've found from both sides, including yourself, Rob, I found some really good deals through through you specifically. I have found deals on MLS. I have found deals through friends who know that I'm in the game of. In the game, in the business of flipping houses, they know what I do, I offer a bit of a referral fee. So I've had friends give me potential deals as well. So, you know, MLS wholesalers, friends and family, I would say.

Rob Break [00:27:07] So when you when you're finding them on MLS, are you finding expired listings or are you finding is there anything special about them or like estate sales? What's going on with the ones you're fighting on MLS

Frank Geneski [00:27:20] and the ones in MLS they look for are mainly power sales, estate sales, like you mentioned. Yes. And houses that need expensive renovations like they have, you know, your handyman specials and needs extensive work. The problem with those is there are tons, tons of guys in the same boat as tons of real estate investors that are out there within minutes of the house being listed on MLS. And lately it's been it's been really, really hot. Multiple bids way over asking. So, like, you really, really got to be specific when you do your estimate for repairs and, you know, you're CMH, like, you've got to be extremely quicks. MLS is a bit tough because you've got to do everything really, really quick. You got to have your financing in place. The banks won't usually won't look at a deal unless it's firm with no financing, no inspection. So, yeah, those are kind of hard to do. But there's there's always good deals out there. I've been outbid actually three times in the last two months on deals in Oshawa, so.

Rob Break [00:28:29] And I know one of the things that I like is I'll bring you my deals first, and of course, I'm not trying to have anyone bid up. The deal is just first come, first serve with me and I. And you're a great buyer. So I bring all the wine to you first, too.

Frank Geneski [00:28:47] So no.

Sandy MacKay [00:28:51] Well, that's if you're looking for private deals, if you don't want to be messing around, right, you want to know that you're good to go and because of the because that will create the relationship that you guys have right there.

Rob Break [00:29:01] Well, he's not you're not competing with anyone for those properties or it's just if you want it, you get it. If you don't want it, then you pass on it.

Frank Geneski [00:29:09] Yeah. And we've been through, like most scenarios where, you know, you gave me properties. I closed really quickly. We've seen other properties where, you know, it wouldn't really work. We have a good relationship. And that's, you know, it's hard to find in real estate because because you mentioned a lot of guys are kind of looking, which I mean, it's not a bad thing. But again, they're kind of looking to get know the highest amount that they can possibly get, but it could screw up the deal for them. Someone may not be prepared. They might want to get a discount. Just a lot of things could be a lot of wrong things could happen.

Rob Break [00:29:42] And I've run into wholesalers or guys who were trying to start wholesaling and they thought that they were just going to find deals on MLS for people. I really don't understand that mentality. That guy said,

Sandy MacKay [00:29:55] I remember a few guys like that. I think,

Rob Break [00:29:57] yeah, I don't understand their value.

Frank Geneski [00:29:59] Like I had a guy like that to you, that's all. So they're called me and he said at the end and he's like, oh, by the way, you know, I'm finding these deals on MLS. And I was like, whoa. Like we smoked for like twenty minutes half an hour ago. You know, I wish you would find me all these properties. And he just said, I'm I'm finding them on MLS. I was you know, I didn't say anything to him. I just thought I was kind of weird.

Sandy MacKay [00:30:21] But it's weird. I think the only because I will say at the very start when I'm very near the start, when when I was doing some wholesaling is. We actually had a property under contract that was on MLS and it was listed at three thirty and it had been listed for months, so it's not like we just got it. It was out there for a while and we had it got under contract to 70 or 280, I believe. So quite a significant discount there. I think that's really the only way you could do that, really, is if you're getting a really good discount that other people wouldn't even really think is possible. Yeah, because and in that case, the guy who ended up buying that and putting in 50 or 60 grand and he sold it for both for 20 or for 30, he made it.

Rob Break [00:31:07] So what you're saying is actually get the deal under contract, though, to.

Sandy MacKay [00:31:12] Well, yeah, I think so, it's hard because if an MLS deal, you can only. You know, you only going to get a week, 10 days, maybe 14 days for your conditions, right? So it's tough.

Rob Break [00:31:24] But I mean, if you can't find a buyer 10, 10 days, then you basically don't have a deal anyway. So I guess. Yeah, yeah. OK, well,

Sandy MacKay [00:31:36] OK, wait, before we go here, what does a real estate agent use for birth control?

Frank Geneski [00:31:44] What's that, what

Sandy MacKay [00:31:46] is his personality?

Rob Break [00:31:47] Oh, boy,

Frank Geneski [00:31:51] oh, very large. I'd really like you to do, actually.

Rob Break [00:31:59] So how do you estimate repairs? I know you're a certified home inspector as well, are you?

Frank Geneski [00:32:06] I yes, I am. I got I did the whole what was it? I believe it was about a month, a month course. I've been Heytesbury my tongue and it was far I did the whole thing with internationally, I believe it was or. Yes, was a while ago. So anyways, I have a message, and to be honest with you, it's it was very, very tough to be a real estate investor and an inspector as well. I kind of had to choose one. I had a good idea of basically every component of the house before I got my electrical in, before I got my own inspection. So that was kind of honestly not the best thing I did. But it was a good learning experience to see that it helped me on some repairs and stuff. I'd be lying. So I think the help that has helped me the most is being a contractor and being, you know, part of the whole process for the last 10 years or so. So that's. The way that I do the estimates is basically come through the House, decide on what you know, what needs to be replaced, how much is it going to cost, what I'm going to do myself, what I'm going to Hiero and things along those lines.

Sandy MacKay [00:33:20] So do you have, like a book with like you're checking off things and writing down repairs, or do you just kind of go and look at everything? I end up go out and write down an estimate after

Frank Geneski [00:33:30] your initial like say, the first time I go into a house is usually I just walk through, maybe take some pictures of stuff that I you know, I want to know that I want to keep on file. And then if I decide that it's something that I want to go forward with, I will come back and I will usually not all the time I've been through properties where I've only done an initial walk through. I'll just walk through it. I look through it. And there's other times where I. Like you said, just write stuff down, jot everything down. I know it's highly recommended to do that, but like I said, I, I do this for a living, so I have a pretty good idea of what needs to be done, you know, for the flip for the end result. So I'd say it's about 50/50 as far as, you know, taking just a walk through and then just writing everything down there needs to be done. Okay.

Rob Break [00:34:17] So is it all a numbers game, like I know the last one that the last deal that you got for me, the place had baseboard heat. And when you walked through and you you went through the whole process of putting in the Forestier gas furnace in and putting all the ductwork in. Now, would that have made or broken the deal or would you have just went through? And if the numbers didn't work out, would you have bought it anyway and just dealt with the baseboard heat or like I guess I'm just curious because, I mean, that's a big undertaking. Right. So how do you there's all of these unforeseen well, not unforeseen, but there's all of these big issues. How do you decide on those types of things?

Frank Geneski [00:35:00] OK, well, that specific property, like you said, it did have the baseboards. And nowadays, you know, if you're flipping a house and you're leaving the baseboards in, like, people are going to be like, what is this house? You know, flipping light, changing everything and then leaving the basements if they're very expensive to heat the house. So, again, that specific property I called my guys my age, five guys that I've been working with for the last little while, I explain everything to them. They gave me an approximate figure of what it would cost. I worked that into my total and basically I wouldn't have taken on that house if if the numbers didn't work for me. To put that in, if I have to put the furnace in air conditioning and there's no way because you're putting all the time and effort and money in at the end, again, people are like, why did you not change the furnace? At least that's what I would I would think. So then I would have I would have definitely passed.

Rob Break [00:35:59] So does that go for every place or would you or was it just that specific one in that area? You knew that it wouldn't work without the force tear gas, or is it ever possible?

Frank Geneski [00:36:14] It it probably wouldn't be everyone. I've done properties where I've left baseboards and if their smaller properties like, say, I townhouses or something, a real townhouse that something really small, maybe like under a thousand square feet. If it doesn't if it doesn't need too much repairs. I have left baseboards in before people have ask questions, but in the end it has sold. It kind of left me with not the best feeling where, you know, people are asking a lot of questions where you did everything so nice, everything is great. Why wouldn't you just replace the baseboards, put in a furnace or commission? The house did so eventually. Obviously at a good I got a good price. But going forward with the next properties that I did in that situation, I told myself, you know, have peace of mind and obviously get to get more value. Like I should mention, you're going to get a lot more value if you add in the furnace and air conditioning compared to living just in sports. But you're going to get the money you put in double that if you decide to put that in.

Rob Break [00:37:16] So and then I guess it sort of goes hand in hand with estimating the repairs. Do you price your flip's lower than the retail market at the time to sell them, or do you play some right where along with everything else? No, I'm pretty conservative.

Frank Geneski [00:37:35] Again, going back to the comparative market analysis and all that, I you know, I find just below the median, I you know, you can't really go too much over. You've got to be really you've got to be pretty strict when it comes to, you know, the end. And no. That you're you're shooting for obviously anything over that is is a bonus. So I'm pretty strict when it comes to the final number.

Sandy MacKay [00:38:00] Yeah. Because you don't want to have the last thing you want to do is have it sitting there for any length of time. Right.

Frank Geneski [00:38:06] The carrying costs and all that stuff, it adds up very quickly. Sure, you guys know, so it's it's pretty conservative out there and yes.

Sandy MacKay [00:38:16] So I think that was an important point you're making to about the baseboards. And that, too, was and, you know, tell me if I'm wrong, but I think it's good to go into a flat, maybe thinking about your potential buyer and what they're going to be thinking of the property right at the end. And if you're a buyer in that area, once forest there, they don't want baseboard heating. You got to get it out of that. Right. I think it all depends on the area. Right. And and what your vision of that buyer is going to be and what their what they what they need and what they want in a property, right?

Frank Geneski [00:38:47] That's exactly right. The one property that I that I decided to leave the base, Fergin, it was in a community like a retirement community and said we're 90 percent of the homes had. So it wasn't something that people I thought people would be asking too much questions about. And, you know, it was just that area. But the property that Rob was talking about, I would say 90 percent of the houses did have furnaces and air conditioning. So I couldn't I couldn't leave that as well. So, yeah, you definitely got to look for your potential buyer and what they're looking for, for sure.

Sandy MacKay [00:39:19] Yeah. So what is most important, do you think, to in general to like the retail buyers? Is it things like furnaces and air conditioning? You know, all the stuff? Is it is it more roof windows foundation, that structural sort of things, or is it just a cosmetic appeal of the property?

Frank Geneski [00:39:42] From my experience and I would probably say from like a lot of the flippers would probably agree with me as well. It's definitely the structural people are going in and looking at right away, looking out windows. If they've been on the roof, they're going in and, you know, looking at the floors, the majority of floors have been done. I think that's not structural, obviously, but it's a big component. It's not really cosmetic. And they're always asking about, you know, how is the first recommissioning look by far the structural. This is a big

Sandy MacKay [00:40:13] and and then in terms of that, too, which one increases the value most like. So structural is really important for sure, because that's if your foundation is all messed up. Obviously, that's going to be very negative for most of the buyers. Well, what's going to increase the volume or is it going to be, you know, if you if you need to fix the foundation, is that really going to increase the value much? Or like,

Rob Break [00:40:41] how do you look? I mean, let's use windows for an example. Like, what if you got some older windows? They don't look great, but they're still OK. But is that the kind of thing that's going to increase the value? Probably like you're a.

Frank Geneski [00:40:56] Well, like you were saying, like if there's a foundation problem and then the windows are older, you're definitely doing the foundation because they're going to come back to the whole mold thing and the mold issue. So it depends. It depends what needs the most work. If you have an old like an older furnace, say, 15 or 20 years old and it's still running fine, maybe it's not efficient. But then you have know, crack windows are leaking in like a leaky roof. You're going to want to they're going to want to take care of those things. First, you got to kind of prioritize if everything is kind of on the same level. But if everything's old

Rob Break [00:41:32] but let's say there's let's say there's no like there's no air leaking through. There's no water coming through, anything like that. But we're just sort of talking about the kind of repairs that will increase the value of the home. Like it's not going to be the windows is going to be like the new kitchen, right?

Frank Geneski [00:41:51] Absolutely. Kitchen in washrooms create a lot of value for sure. Those are the two big things. If you're doing if you're going to be renovating anything, put in put in a nice kitchen and renovate the washer. The reason is people obviously don't want to buy a house. They don't want to be taking on bigger projects themselves. A kitchen in washrooms are a bigger projects, so they want to come in to a nice washroom. And you don't have to worry about if they got to fix the roof, you know, that can be done on the outside. They don't really have to get to. Obviously, it's an expensive repair, but they don't really have to get rid of all this. Not going to affect their everyday living compared to someone being in your house. You're doing the washroom for about a week or, you know, a little bit more even for the kitchen. So kitchen and washers inside for sure. No question.

Rob Break [00:42:40] Yeah, I guess it's a balancing act. Have you ever worked ever worked on a flip where you've left something that you felt should be done just because the numbers didn't work out? Or have you gone for a cosmetic improvement over sort of a some kind of structural improvement just because you knew that that would increase the value more in the budget didn't allow for the other one to be done, that kind of thing, or.

Frank Geneski [00:43:07] Yeah, actually, that's a good question, because you're the last property you ended up doing the numbers like I was on my budget and I start to do the floors, all the floors in the house. We initially had hardwood plants which do hardwood didn't work out. We ended up putting in carpet. Obviously, hardwood adds a lot more value, but carpet is a lot cheaper and it worked out OK. It was something that, you know, I didn't want to do. I had carpet bag with a passion, but I still had to do it in the end. So it's like it's exactly we said you going to balance things out at the end and do what's best for the for the bottom number.

Rob Break [00:43:51] And that's do you think that that hurt your your selling price?

Frank Geneski [00:43:56] I mean. We could have got definitely kind of got a little bit more for the hard wood, absolutely. But we're waiting it out compared to what we could have got compared to going over my budget, spending a little bit more time. And then because we actually do the hard with myself, I do most of the foreign stuff for myself. It kind of wait out anyway. But again, we could have got a little bit more for the hardwood for sure in the end.

Rob Break [00:44:23] OK, now I guess, is there any tricks of the trade that can help someone save money? Look, what areas can somebody, I don't know, not cut corners, but maybe maybe utilize some imagination instead of money?

Frank Geneski [00:44:39] The things that I've learned from the last several years of doing flips is I take everything hands on. I'm very involved in the process. Like I said, I would consider myself a very Part-Time realtor and a full time contractor and real estate flipper. I choose to do one thing and I do all the flooring in the painting and in all my properties. So this way, I mean, as far as being a trick to save some money, I would say I would tell somebody to possibly get good at something. If it's either painting or selling trim or whatever it may be, you will save a lot of money. You will learn you will learn a lot. Go that way as far as adding value. And there's not much that I can offer except for find yourself a good team, guys that you can you can trust. That's one of the biggest things that I've I've learned that has told me a lot is that I don't have to baby sit. I just tell them my game plan. I let them go to the house, do what they've got to do and that's about it. And it's taken me several years to do this. And I've made lots of mistakes in the past by hiring the cheapest guys and guys that I just for the first time that I've used on bigger projects linked to an entire kitchen. So basically get a lot of referrals. It will save you money. And for sure.

Sandy MacKay [00:45:58] Well, that's an important point. There, too, is making mistakes and stuff because we talked about that a lot. Pretty much all of our guests, Rob, I think have mentioned something along that line is this, you know, you're going to make mistakes anyway. So, you know, you just got to go for it and and learn as you go and educate yourself as much as you can. But just don't be scared of making the mistakes. You're going to jump in at some point and you're going to make mistakes no matter how skilled and educated you are and all that. So I think that's an important point to make.

Frank Geneski [00:46:28] Yeah. So I know some of the guys that I talked to there, they have the mindset that everything is going to go perfect when they do these flips. But I've I've talked to guys that have gotten involved in and it's kind of gotten not so good. They think everything just goes on schedule and all the guys they hire will do what they say they'll do. They won't ask for more money and then they'll do it. Just it doesn't work like that. And I tell them it's OK, but it's fine. Just, you know, learn learn from it exactly what you said. So it's definitely a learning, learning thing.

Rob Break [00:46:59] You've already kind of touched on this, but how involved are you in the process?

Frank Geneski [00:47:04] Yeah, I'm very, very tough. I mean, they're pretty much like I said, I have a team that I've worked with for the last, I would say, at least two years. I haven't hired anybody new for anything big for the last couple of years. So I have an electrician, plumber, each of our guys, roofers, window guys like pretty much everything that I work with for a very long time. I guess I'm not the type of guy to sit over someone's shoulder and, you know, kind of look at what they're doing. But I really like to be on the job job. So most of the time, tying loose ends, there's always things that need to be done. So I'm pretty. I'm very, very involved. I don't hire a general contractor to take on the project myself. Practically everything. Hands on for sure.

Rob Break [00:47:49] But you also mentioned that you're doing all of the painting. You never hire painters.

Frank Geneski [00:47:56] Most of the time I do all the painting myself. It depends on the project. It depends on the budget. I depends, you know, it depends on the House. If it's just a cosmetic flip, if I have other things going on, I might decide to get someone to paint for me. If it's a big, big, big project where I have to get a ton of different trades, then absolutely, I'll do the flooring myself. I'll do the painting myself, which in the end, you know, obviously you have to put in your time. At the end, you still got to calculate what you know, what you're what you would charge for that. And I don't consider the final number. But again, it's so beneficial. Right.

Rob Break [00:48:34] I would I would I would not recommend that for most people. I think that I mean, I've seen your deals and for the most part, you don't need to be in there doing those things you're doing. You're in there because that's what you like to do. That's where you want to be. And you probably wouldn't choose to be anywhere else if you had the choice, which you do. So I guess I guess

Frank Geneski [00:48:58] you know what? I hear that a lot. I hear that from neighbors. I hear that from neighbors that the houses were working and even the guys they work with, like, why are you why are you here? But you don't need to be here to get people to do this for you. But like I said, I like to be involved. I, I wake up very early in the morning ready to go. I like I enjoy doing it. It's exactly what you said. I, I'd rather not do anything else. But that's so. Is this the boys from your. Yeah, it also helps them know the final number, obviously, but there's guys out there, which I'm sure you guys have spoken to before. They you know, they hide everything, which is totally fine. I'm not against that, obviously, but I just like I like to be involved.

Rob Break [00:49:43] Well, I mean, let's talk specifically about me for a second. I. I'm pretty good at demolition, but aside from that, my skills lie maybe on the phone or or, you know, I can I have a good vision and I can calculate costs and then I can organize the job. But men, sometimes when I when I start trying to do work, I just wonder why the heck I would even dream of doing it. Because a lot of times I'm half decently handy, but a lot of times I take on too much myself. And I think I've learned that over the last little while here is that I'm more than likely better off just having somebody else do it, the professional and and sticking to what I'm really good at.

Frank Geneski [00:50:41] Yeah, no, that makes sense for sure, but it comes back to where I have been a contractor for a while, so I'm very comfortable doing the flooring and the painting. What I found out, something that I've done actually the last couple of years is concentrating on a specific thing with a professional kind of work with them almost for nothing but for them to teach me the trade. For example, the last couple of years I've been working with a guy that does my trim and I told him, listen, I'm very interested in doing trim, not to take your job, but just have a lot of interest. And I think it looks really nice. And do you mind teaching that to me? So for the last couple of years here and there, he's been teaching. I've been taking that on. And, you know, when he's busy, I kind of do it myself. Lately, I've been doing the same thing with ducks. I've been learning how to do ducks with a professional. And that's not to say that I'm taking all that on myself. It's just I enjoy doing it again. It goes back to liking what you do.

Rob Break [00:51:40] Well, I just want everyone to be clear that we're not necessarily the most flip's would be a gigantic disaster if the if the person who was running the person who is doing the flip was actually in there doing the work.

Frank Geneski [00:51:55] Yeah, no. If you try to do it all yourself, it's very tough for sure, to say the least. You're not going to, especially if you're just getting into it. I would highly recommend that

Sandy MacKay [00:52:07] I would give up on day one. I would stop there and I would just be like, oh my God, what what do I do?

Frank Geneski [00:52:14] So it's always really overwhelming. When you first started doing it for sure, there's a there's so much that needs to be done, right. So nothing goes on schedule. First of all, you know, guys are always usually a little late. But again, it's part of the whole flipping thing. You know,

Rob Break [00:52:29] you just don't show up.

Sandy MacKay [00:52:32] Yeah.

Rob Break [00:52:32] So, yeah, I want to thank you again, because when I did my the flip over just around the corner here from my place, very first one, I hired a general contractor at first and you know, I was all excited. Get going. I was going to work alongside of him and learn everything like you were saying. And he didn't show up for the first three days. So I called you and I said, you know, I'm thinking about fire in the sky. What do you think? And you're like, Biram, I'll walk you through it. So that's exactly what I did. And I mean, that scared the that scared the crap out of me. But luckily, you were there and you said, OK, this is what you need to do. Do this, this, this. Then once those things are done, call me back and I'll help you out again. And I mean, that was priceless. I could not have done that with you.

Sandy MacKay [00:53:22] And I was having a team. Right. Oh.

Frank Geneski [00:53:25] Yeah, and I'm sure you learned the electoral process, you know what to do next time you're going to be a lot more comfortable. It's a good learning experience. Radlick There's a lot of great contractors out there that you can can trust. You know, you can tell them what you want to do. They'll do it on time. But there's guys out there like that. But I mean, not to knock the whole contractor industry. There's a lot of guys out there that, you know, like to cut corners, take advantage of people I don't like to talk about. I don't like to talk about anybody. But you've got to be really careful, really, really, really careful on who you hire. And that's, again, one of the reasons why I do the whole general contractor thing myself. I like to be in control of the whole flip thing. Like I said, I'm not doing more sort of stuff, but I'm still, you know, hiring people that I think are capable of doing it properly. At first, probably like most people, it's cost go for the cheapest guy. I mean, that's a huge mistake, which I'm I'm sure any decent real estate investor has learned. Never hired the cheapest guy. I made a mistake a lot of time.

Sandy MacKay [00:54:35] So, Frank, what's next for you? Where are you envisioning yourself going with a still going to be doing flips full time? Do you want to get into some other types of investments or what do you got planned?

Frank Geneski [00:54:50] A goal that I have probably for this year is to get into a commercial real estate doing a bit the first part of our due diligence as far as having a commercial investment property reason is obviously there's high risk, but high reward as well. I'm not too fond of the word I've been I've been there way, way too many times in the past. I find that it's it's very pro tenants. That's not to say that you can run residential property successfully in property. But I've been looking at the commercial side of it. So long term plan is to get into something commercial while doing my flip stock for sure. I don't think I would ever give up the flipping or get away from that.

Sandy MacKay [00:55:35] OK, so you are working a little more towards the buy and hold type of type of things and then just, you know, flipping at the same time just to keep the cash flow coming in. Right.

Frank Geneski [00:55:45] That's that's exactly that's what I have for sure.

Rob Break [00:55:50] And I know you were telling me that you were sort of looking into hard money lending as well.

Frank Geneski [00:55:56] Yeah, that's another thing I've been researching when I get a couple of minutes of my day is hard money lending. And it's something that's appealing. It's just that that's extremely risky business as far as the research I've done right now. There's there's companies who successfully do it out there. But, yeah, that's something I'd be interested, as I've also looked into investing in other businesses as well, start up businesses and things along those lines. But again, if it's kind of risky at this point. So there's a lot of good things out there. You know, you just got to educate yourself to the max for sure.

Rob Break [00:56:29] You're probably at the landlord tenant board too many times because you didn't pick up our freedom of the seven freedoms activities that you can trigger in your property starting right now.

Frank Geneski [00:56:38] And we didn't look into any of that for sure.

Rob Break [00:56:41] You're not holding on to any properties right now, are you?

Frank Geneski [00:56:46] I have a duplex and we have one which I have long term tenants in there, which has been going for over first people that came in, I rent it to them. It is green. Yeah, kind of. I don't believe repairs on for too long. It's just they do not need the property in general. So, I mean, I probably do another interview of my, you know, my landlord tenant board experience. But yeah, he's got to educate yourself like it's not as hard as a lot of people think if you if you educate yourself. So, yeah, that's great. You guys have some info to help out. I guess people that just got into a property or have a couple of properties, I'm sure the information you guys have is a super.

Rob Break [00:57:26] Is there a quote or a piece of mind for advice that's always stuck with you, and how has it helped you out?

Frank Geneski [00:57:33] Actually, like a lot of quotes. Nothing really sticks out in my mind right now except for the fact that you've got to work hard. It's simple as that. Nothing comes easy. You really got to work hard on whatever it is that you're doing. If you're looking for deals or if that's just your business, if you're a realtor or if you're a flipper, you just got to work really hard. You know, it's not. Something that's going to come to you is how can we get leads? You're not going to, you know, just hire a perfect contractor to do stuff. You got to go to work every day. And if you do do that, what I found is you will be successful. When I first got my realtor's license, a quick, quick little story by chance. So I called I pretty much called his producer by chance. I'd write at home. And I've heard this advice from other people as well, specifically from some of my family members that have been in the contracting business. I've always heard them saying, but I never really spoke to me up until I started doing stuff myself. Are you just really got to work hard, whatever it is that you're doing? Like I said, if you're if you're looking for deals, if you're a wholesaler, if you're a realtor because you're a contractor, you just you have to work hard. That's all it is. And what he told me was, if you really want to be successful and that's kind of where it just stuck to me. And I was like, well, OK, I'm hearing this way too much. Maybe it's something to actually listen to and take seriously. He said, if you work hard, if you if you're really interested in the business, you will you will succeed. So my advice would be work really hard and you will be successful. It's kind of almost almost a guarantee I can make and face easily.

Rob Break [00:59:21] It's pretty close to a Winston Churchill quote that says something like consistent effort, not intelligence or strength or the keys to success or something like that. I think it is sounds almost like the same the same advice right there.

Frank Geneski [00:59:38] Yeah, there's there's a ton of them out there. I love I love all those quotes.

Sandy MacKay [00:59:42] The good thing about that, too, is like finding out what real hard work is, because, you know, if you're lucky, like you mentioned, you called the lead producer right at home, you know, his idea of working hard is probably a lot different than the mediocre producer there, you know? So it's good to see you with the top. You know, someone who is a real top producer or a top achiever in whatever field it is. You can see what hard work looks like to them. You know, that's a big difference from what hard work looks like to other people. So I think that's a good thing to do is to to really reach out to people like that.

Frank Geneski [01:00:14] Yeah, and it's the whole thing of exactly what you said, no, it's some people don't really know how to work hard. So when someone tells you this guy's like, no, you've got to go out there. And Dornoch, I was like, doorknocker like, really? That's actually I was like, wow, like door knocking. I never thought I thought it would just be annoying. People is like, yeah, you know, nine out of ten people you probably will be annoying, but you just got to suck it up and move on. Don't take it personally, just keep moving.

Rob Break [01:00:36] Where can people learn more about you.

Frank Geneski [01:00:40] I have a realtor site, my first and last name to be dangerous, if anyone wants to reach me for whatever reason that they can email me or call me. If you see the information right now, I can.

Rob Break [01:00:53] Yeah, sure. Go ahead and we'll link to it on our show notes. And anyone who is interested can find it all right there.

Frank Geneski [01:01:01] You know, so if there's any other old sellers that have deals, they can definitely contact me. The other night there's a realtor, so I don't really need any realtors. But yeah, anyways, they can contact me by email as if Genachowski Gmail dot com and like Rob just mentioned, I'm sure it will be in the notes. So I'd be happy to talk with anyone that has any questions about anything.

Sandy MacKay [01:01:25] Yeah. And so it's an FDA and the E and E. S K i

Frank Geneski [01:01:31] dotcom dot com. Yep. That's the real truth. So like I said, it's very basic, but there's all the information is up there for me.

Rob Break [01:01:40] OK, great, well, I really do appreciate you coming on tonight. You shared a lot of information with us all, and I'm sure it'll be useful to everybody that's listening. Yeah, totally. And you know

Frank Geneski [01:01:52] what we're having.

Rob Break [01:01:53] It'll be very interesting if we did have you back to talk about all your landlord tenant board issues.

Frank Geneski [01:02:01] Yeah, I bet I could probably have an easy couple of shows, if not just one. And I'm not proud of that in any way. Don't get me wrong. It's just I guess I could tell you guys a lot of stories

Rob Break [01:02:14] that I'd like to

Sandy MacKay [01:02:15] say, like a good show down the road for sure.

Rob Break [01:02:18] It's no, we've all been there a few times,

Frank Geneski [01:02:21] but I appreciate you guys having me on for sure. Well, there isn't anything out there like where you guys are doing it. It is very beneficial to any investors that every at every stage of the game. So I thank you guys for having the show for all of us.

Rob Break [01:02:35] OK, we'll have a good night. We'll talk to you soon. Thank you.

Frank Geneski [01:02:39] OK, guys, thanks. Thanks, everybody.

Sandy MacKay [01:02:42] All right. So a quick reminder, everyone, to leave your questions and comments over a break through our podcast.

Rob Break [01:02:49] Thanks for listening. Get out there and get to it.

Sandy MacKay [01:02:54] That's good. Yeah, yeah.

Rob Break [01:03:19] And you were probably at the landlord tenant board too many times because you didn't read the seven freedom activators you can trigger in your property starting right now, which is available for free on our Web site. So maybe you should pick that up, it's free. Oh, is he gone? He's gone. I guess he didn't like my advice, no.

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