Mixed-Use & Commercial Purchases, CMHC Underwriting with Christian Szpilfogel

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Podcast Transcription

Georges El Masri [00:00:01] Welcome to the Well Off podcast, where the goal is to motivate, inspire and share success principles. I’m your host, Georges El Masri. Thanks for joining me. I interviewed Cristian. He’s an experienced real estate investor and entrepreneur. He’s the chief investment officer of the Ali Farris Group with holdings in multi-unit residential. They have commercial properties and he strongly believes in giving back to the community by spreading his knowledge. And that’s why he agreed to do this podcast. So on this episode, we talked about why he decided to transition to full time real estate investing in 2017, breaking down his recent acquisition of a three property portfolio, CMHC underwriting, and why it’s beneficial to get commercial financing. His strategy on successfully qualifying for CMHC underwritten mortgages and I think you guys are going to really benefit from listening to this episode, especially if you have properties that are five residential units or larger or multi or I should say, mixed use building. So there you go. And if you guys appreciate the content, as always, I’ll ask you to leave us a review on the Apple Podcast platform and then give us a look and subscribe on YouTube. That’s very helpful to us and it’s greatly appreciated. Thank you for all the support over the years. Now it’s been a couple of years that I’ve been doing this podcast, so I appreciate all your support. And then finally, if you want to reach out to me to talk about some multi-unit investment opportunities, there are so many deals out there right now that we’re finding that are on the market. Off market, we have different opportunities for different investors. So make sure to reach out to me on Instagram while off. Send me a message or book a call on the website. Well, after Isaiah. There you go. Enjoy the episode. All right. I’m here with Christian. Thank you for joining me today all the way from Ottawa. I appreciate you doing this.

Christian Szpilfogel [00:01:50] It’s my pleasure to be on your show, George.

Georges El Masri [00:01:52] Great. I like to start off. If you heard any of the previous episodes, it’s always the same thing. Tell me about your childhood. Couple of things you remember.

Christian Szpilfogel [00:02:02] About my childhood. I was a nerdy kid. When I was young, I was into science fiction, engineering, all that kind of stuff. So that ultimately led to a to a degree in physics and engineering later on. So, yeah, I was that kid in school.

Georges El Masri [00:02:23] Okay, that’s cool. I know it seems nerdy at first, but I think some nerds have accomplished some pretty cool things. Well, like I would consider Elon Musk to be a nerd. Steve Jobs to be a bit of a nerd. Those guys have done some cool things.

Christian Szpilfogel [00:02:38] Well, I’ll tell you, when it comes to the real estate side of things, the one thing that it gave me was an aptitude in math. And math is absolutely critical in this business. Yeah. So it definitely was a win in that respect. And I’ll have to say it was all super fun.

Georges El Masri [00:02:56] Yeah. Yeah. Cool. So let’s talk a bit about your journey into real estate. Tell us a bit of what you do now and then maybe a background story of how you got started.

Christian Szpilfogel [00:03:05] Mm hmm. You know, I kind of fell into real estate. I wasn’t one of these people who woke up one day and said, I must be in real estate. My wife and I, I know it was talked about the possibility of doing real estate as a way of producing retirement funds because neither of us had a pension. So it was something that we had considered. And then one day a purpose built. Four plex right next to our house came up for sale. And I thought about it and I asked my wife, I said, What do you think? She said, Why not? Let’s go for it. So that was my first purchase. That really kind of got things rolling. And I’ll admit, I was really super nervous about the whole thing. We were a single income family. This was a four plex to buy, and I just analyzed it to death. I spent about a week analyzing this thing before I finally had confidence that I could pull this off. I did all kinds of scenario testing. You know what? If interest rates went up, what if vacancies were high? All that kind of stuff. So that was my first foray into real estate. And then we kind of caught the bug from there.

Georges El Masri [00:04:20] Mm hmm. Okay. And then so from that point, did you continue buying for Plex’s and that sort of thing, or did your strategy change at all?

Christian Szpilfogel [00:04:29] Oh, no, that that’s actually the smallest building we ever bought when we so we started with the floor and then a little while later, because we didn’t really know what we were doing. Right. It’s like a lot of people who first start off in real estate, you kind of feel your way through it. And at the time, there wasn’t as much in the way of at least understanding that there were coaches or courses or all of these things. So we kind of felt our way through it at the beginning. So we had a bit of a slow roll our next. Purchase was probably about four years later and we bought a six plex, which we later converted to nine. And that six plex was the first commercial building that we bought for commercial residential building, and we just kept going from there and just getting bigger and bigger. So the yeah, so that six unit was, was an interesting purchase. And later on what we did was we did take courses; we went on a learning track to understand how to do real estate properly and that actually really accelerated everything for us. We started buying that. We figured out how to refinance these things much more efficiently, get better leverage, make more intelligent purchases, buying strategically, understanding market analysis, financial analysis, all of that stuff that really sparked things up for us. And then from there, we just went on a buying spree once we started having a lot of capital and we’ve continued that model ever since. So and I’ve been a professional investor since about 2017. Okay.

Georges El Masri [00:06:14] So were you working throughout up until 2017 or did you leave your job earlier?

Christian Szpilfogel [00:06:21] No, no, no. I left my job. It was really quite, quite interesting. The you know, it was technology based. We were doing lots of new cool development. I was running a division there in the in the tech in the firm that I was at. So it was always really interesting. So, no, I didn’t have any real desire to leave my job. But then life events happened. You know, as I’ve mentioned publicly before, a daughter that had serious mental health issues. And so my job was so demanding that I needed to find another avenue. And our real estate business had already crossed the point where it was demanding more and more of my time and I had a decision to make, but my daughter situation really forced the issue. So I might have transitioned a little later, but that became a priority in my life, in the real estate business, gave me the freedom to take care of her. That’s really what it came down to.

Georges El Masri [00:07:29] Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. Well, I’m sorry to hear about the trouble that you guys were going through. Hopefully things are okay.

Christian Szpilfogel [00:07:37] Yeah, yeah, things are much better. She’s very stable now. She’s got. She’s working as a counselor for young offenders now. She’s so she’s been stable for the last two years. You know, and one thing that’s that I’ve discovered through that journey is that, you know, most families are dealing with some elements of mental health. So my daughter and I decided that we would always speak publicly about this kind of thing and not hide in, you know, hide away from what happened. And it’s important because people need to understand that, that they’re not alone, that there are other people going through the same thing, and that you can reach out to people for help. And like I said, you know, the journey into real estate and like most forms of entrepreneurship give you the freedom to prioritize things that are important in your life, as opposed to when I was at work, you know, in a in a corporate job, I kind of liken it to a gilded cage. I was paid well, you know, I had a good lifestyle. But your time was owned by somebody else. Mm hmm. And, you know, once I left, I did. Once I left and became a real entrepreneur, I understood there was a huge difference. I feel free, and that’s really what it comes down to.

Georges El Masri [00:08:59] Yeah. If you could change the past, would you try to have left earlier or would you would you leave earlier your job? Or do you feel like things worked out the way they should have?

Christian Szpilfogel [00:09:10] Yeah, it’s that’s a great question and it’s always difficult to answer. Certainly, my, you know, my career, my history, the things the challenges that I’ve gone through have made me who I am to make me more successful at what I do now. Should I have left earlier? Probably. I would probably say that if I’d left even five years earlier, I don’t think the outcome in terms of what I do now, you know, I don’t think I’d be less efficient at what I do now. And I would have had an earlier jump into the real estate markets and. And having an even more fun. Mm hmm.

Georges El Masri [00:09:49] Yeah.

Christian Szpilfogel [00:09:51] I kind of feel like I’m a building collector, so I guess I would have a bigger collection, but.

Georges El Masri [00:09:54] Yeah, yeah, yeah. So what kind of buildings are you? Like, what’s the more? Most recent project what’s exciting now in and what you do.

Christian Szpilfogel [00:10:04] Yeah that that’s another great question because people often ask me well where do you invest and what do you buy? And the reality is that over time things change. So what was hot three or four years ago isn’t what’s hot now, and it’s not what’s going to be hot in a few years. Even the locations, they change. So we’re really quite good. We do a lot of work in market analysis and understand where the next market is likely to start evolving. We don’t count on it. So to be clear, we’re not speculators. We don’t go into a market because we think it’s going to take off. We go into market because it shows the fundamentals that it will grow and we just make assumptions that it’s going to grow over the long term. If it happens to do really well in the short term, that’s just a bonus. So we don’t count on that, but we do market analysis to make sure we’re on sound fundamental economic conditions. And the other is asset classes. So when I first left, my priority was cash flow. And at the time, cash flow was easy to get in things like commercial buildings in particular, light industrial. Light industrial has relatively low capital acquisition costs, but they generate very high cash flow. Now that’s changed a little bit because the cap rates have come down on that. So we’ve also do multi-family residential. We love that asset class. But I would say that the class that I’m most attuned to right now and that I think is doing well is Main Street mixed use. So where you have commercial on the main floor and you have residential above it and we usually target properties that have 30% or less commercial gross leasable area compared to the rest of the building. Because then you get the best of both worlds. You’ve got some of the commercial aspects in terms of cap rates where you can typically buy those and still cash flow. And then you get the benefit of, for example, CMHC insurance, which will give you a more attractive loan to values, more attractive interest rates, and better cash flow optimization rates and longer plantations.

Georges El Masri [00:12:23] Well, can we go through an example of a recent project of yours to kind of see what the cap rates are, what kind of rents you’re getting there? Just kind of like an overview.

Christian Szpilfogel [00:12:34] Sure. So we’ve got a number of projects on the go. One that that I like in particular is an acquisition of a portfolio that we did in a town called Almont, Ontario. So the three buildings in that acquisition are all on the main street in that town. That town is a beautiful, picturesque town. It’s also the hometown of Maggie Smith, who was the founder of basketball. So for all the Raptors fans here. Right, that’s where it all started. Yes. James Naismith and his statue is actually right in front of one of my buildings. Cool. So that’s kind of cute. So the math around that acquisition is interesting. So there are three mixed use buildings on the main street. They the acquisition was done at a six cap, which included, you know, all the normal underwriting that you would do. So some people tend to write optimistically. I tend to underwrite conservatively so that my underwriting is conservative enough that I basically just hand it to my appraiser and he’ll take it almost as is. He’ll do his own due diligence, of course, but the underwriting will be as close to what he was going to produce anyway. So that includes, you know, 5% repairs, maintenance and capital reserves. That includes assumption of 5% property management plus all of the other costs associated with the property. So that’s a conservative six cap. So what it meant when we did the acquisition is we were able to, of course, finance it with CMHC underwriting because the commercial space was under 30%. And so we got great terms, long amortization and relatively low interest rate. And so the benefit there, was it cash flow, it was accretive right up on acquisition was adding substantially to our cash flow position. But the bonus in this property was not just that, it was the rents, commercial rents, residential rents were all very low relative to the market and the demographics of the tenants were of the demographic type that tends to rotate every. 2 to 3 years. So I could see that within four, you know, three, four, maybe five years on the outside, I’d probably get about 80% turnover and all the leases in that time bring it to market rent. Then when I said it was under market rent, it was under market rent by almost 50%. So huge amount of upside on this when we go to do our refi in four or five years.

Georges El Masri [00:15:22] Okay. Very cool. Um. Low interest, good cash flow with the low rents. So you mentioned CMHC underwriting. Can you tell us a little bit about why it’s important for you to get properties that qualify for CMHC underwriting?

Christian Szpilfogel [00:15:40] Absolutely. So the advantage with using CMHC in commercial properties. So what we’re talking about is they’ll only do residential buildings and they’ll only do for the commercial underwriting that will typically fall in the five units or more bucket. They will also include mixed use buildings so long as I said earlier, the grossly small area of the commercial space is less than 30% of the building. 30% or less, to be more precise. So why do I like CMHC as the insurer? There’s three main attributes that you get out of it. One is you get a higher loan to value than you would from conventional finance. And so not including there’s two programs in CMHC, there’s an MLRS select program, but the conventional CMHC program gives you up to 85% loan to value. It will give you a preferred interest rate because there’s no risk to the lender now. So you see mix taking on that risk. So usually that results in a four point less interest cost versus a conventional. And the other thing that I really like is that you can get much longer amortization. So conventional financing, you might only get to 30% or sorry, 30 year amortization, whereas with CMHC, depending on the condition of the building, you can get up to 40 years of amortization. And so the nice thing about that longer amortization plus the lower interest rate is it improves your overall cash flow position. Well, and for people who are nervous and want to do more principal pay down, all I suggest is that rather than having the bank store the money for you and you can’t access it to the refi, you just take that excess. What would have been principal payment and put it into a reserve fund that you can access later?

Georges El Masri [00:17:30] Okay. Just to make sure I heard you correctly, you’re saying that basically if you have five units or more residential, then you may be able to qualify for CMHC underwriting, is that correct?

Christian Szpilfogel [00:17:41] Absolutely. So CMHC will underwrite anything, five units or more that’s residential or mixed use where the commercial space is less than 30%.

Georges El Masri [00:17:51] Okay. So how do you go about getting the financing on this? Because I guess CMHC will work with multiple lenders in that situation and they’re just kind of underwriting it or.

Christian Szpilfogel [00:18:03] No, it doesn’t normally work like that. So there’s two approaches that are normally used. So CMHC is just an independent, you know, pseudo government body. They don’t do anything like they’re not banks themselves. They’re just insurers. Yeah. So most people what you will end up doing this, you’ll be working with a lender and the lender will interface with CMHC in order to get the insurance. Okay. Some brokers have the capability of interacting with CMHC directly. And so there’s, you know, I have one broker where what they’ll do is, you know, we’ll do all the underwriting, will get CMHC qualified and have them at issue or effectively be prepared to issue a certificate of insurance. And then we shop it out to the lenders in order to see who is going to give us the best terms, given that it’s already been done by CMHC. Mm hmm. So most people won’t do it. The way I just described; most people will end up selecting a lender. Let’s see, MLS or First National or TD or any of these lenders. And the lender will actually run the process for you. Okay.

Georges El Masri [00:19:10] So you’re saying basically get approval from CMHC first and then you have your broker shop that approval to different lenders to make it make the deal happen.

Christian Szpilfogel [00:19:22] That’s the ideal scenario. But most brokers can’t or won’t do that. Okay, so you’re the brokers that will do it that way, or typically very large brokers, national level brokers. So that’s why I was saying if most commercial brokers, they’re going to find you the lender and the lender is going to interface with CMHC to get this stuff. Yeah. So that’s for a vast majority of people. That’s how it’s going to work.

Georges El Masri [00:19:47] Okay. And typically there would be like a minimum dollar amount that they would work with, right? Like if you have a $200,000 property and you’re trying to get this CMHC underwritten product, it probably won’t happen. Is that right?

Christian Szpilfogel [00:20:02] That’s a really good question. I don’t know where the bottom is.

Georges El Masri [00:20:06] Yeah.

Christian Szpilfogel [00:20:08] I mean, our stuff is all typically in the millions. Yeah. And I know some lenders won’t do commercial deals that are less than, say, $1,000,000. Exactly. So that’s probably where the real limit is. And I’m sure that CMHC itself has bound.

Georges El Masri [00:20:24] Yeah.

Christian Szpilfogel [00:20:25] But then, you know, you can get other types of loan structure. Some lenders might go lower. And I’ve certainly done first really small stuff. I’ve used business loans instead and then just use the property as the, you know, for the lean.

Georges El Masri [00:20:39] Yeah. And when you are getting this type of financing, do you have to do a phase one environmental typically?

Christian Szpilfogel [00:20:45] Well, for CMHC, yeah, they do require a phase one environmental for sure.

Georges El Masri [00:20:49] Okay. So you’d have that additional cost of a few thousand bucks to get that report done?

Christian Szpilfogel [00:20:55] Yeah. I mean, that’s one of the things that probably should be highlighted is when you’re doing commercial financing, it’s quite different than residential financing. And residential financing, as you know, you know, you don’t pay for much except maybe your lawyer or even the appraisal. You can usually get the bank to pay for that. But when you’re doing commercial finance and you’re paying for everything, you’re paying for your lawyers, of course you’re paying for phase one environmental report. You’re paying for an appraisal. You’re doing a condition assessment for your own peace of mind. And you’re paying commitment fees. You’re paying to the bank. So that’s usually in the order of 1%. You might be paying a broker fee as well, depending on the lender. And the static source is that you get to pay the lender’s lawyers’ fees as well. And as it turns out, the lender’s lawyer doesn’t go and get the most economical lawyer out there. They go to Bay Street in Toronto and find the most expensive lawyer. Yeah.

Georges El Masri [00:21:57] Yeah. So there’s definitely an additional cost. But again, just like anything else, if it if it’s beneficial for you because for example, if you have, let’s say, a five or six unit building, you could kind of take it off your personal liabilities in a sense, and move it into a commercial space where it might open you up to be able to refinance other properties, that sort of thing. Right.

Christian Szpilfogel [00:22:23] It does. So that the I love the commercial space. So when I say commercial, I include large residential. So the commercial space, what’s beautiful about it is the financing doesn’t depend on your income. It depends on the performance of the properties and how it works. You’ll still have to personally guarantee it because I’m not aware of too many non-recourse loans in Canada, but so you still have to do that and you do need some amount of net worth to backstop it. If you don’t have it personally, then you have got somebody involved in the in the transaction who has a net worth to be able to guarantee the loan. But it’s and the other thing that I think I want to point out, so I was talking about all those expenses. But as you know, George, the that’s actually the normal way of doing the financing for just about anything. The exception is residential housing, small residential housing, where you don’t end up paying any fees. That’s actually the exception in the investment world. So the model of paying everything yourself is something that you need to, you know, that people need to get used to and understand. And quite frankly, once you get used to it, it’s just part of the costs of doing acquisitions.

Georges El Masri [00:23:39] Absolutely. I know obviously, like you’re not a mortgage broker, but just so the listeners can get an idea, right now it’s September 20, 22. Just an idea of what rates are for a recent project you had like, are you close to prime or are you over Prime? Below Prime with ICBC underwriting mortgage.

Christian Szpilfogel [00:24:00] Yeah. So with commercial financing, you’re typically taking loans that are built on top of the bond market. So it’s based mostly on the bond yields and where they’re currently sitting. So on top of that, you’ll have the bank will take the spread. That’s their profit. And then what? They offer you is basically the rate. So it tends to change. It doesn’t really work like a bank crime; it doesn’t work like a residential market and has relatively little bearing to Bank of Canada announcements of example. And there are times when commercial rates are actually less than what you might get on the residential side. For a variable rate. You can have an inversion that happens there. Yeah. Now the rates are typically a little bit higher than what you’d get. So if you might get a residential five year term at, you know, let’s say it’s 3%, the commercial equivalent with CMHC underwriting might be 4% or four and a half percent. So we’re not talking crazy stuff. And when you buy the asset, you just make that assumption. It’s just part of your underlying costs.

Georges El Masri [00:25:15] Mm hmm. Well, you’re getting a slightly higher rate, but you’re also getting the 40 or M, so the payment might be might even be a little bit less than a residential monthly payment.

Christian Szpilfogel [00:25:27] Oh, for sure. So if you’re combining that, too, with the CMHC offer and then getting the longer amortization, you’re absolutely right. The net cash flow is going to be is generally better than what you’d get as a regular single family, even though you’re paying a higher interest rate. And don’t forget to the premium that you pay for CMHC, which is typically 4 to 4 and a half percent, the loan size that is then amortized on your loan as well. So you pay it, but it’s actually put into the loan. But then you can write it off for the first term of the loan. Yeah. So if you get, say, a five year term, then you’ll take that CMHC fee and you’ll just spread it out and expense that one fifth every year, which is a net benefit as well. Yeah.

Georges El Masri [00:26:14] Cool. Maybe one last question on this. Again, you’re not a.

Christian Szpilfogel [00:26:20] Licensed mortgage broker. So, you know.

Georges El Masri [00:26:22] This is an important thing.

Christian Szpilfogel [00:26:25] That people should be consulting with their professionals for, you know, with respect to anything like this.

Georges El Masri [00:26:30] Okay. We’re getting a general overview from here.

Christian Szpilfogel [00:26:32] So we’re doing.

Georges El Masri [00:26:33] Okay. So when you’re buying these mixed use buildings, typically you have to pay HST on the purchase. Correct.

Christian Szpilfogel [00:26:40] So you pay HST on the commercial portion. So when you’re doing a when you buy a residential building, be it a commercial residential or small residential, there is HST, but it’s built in already. So the price includes HST and you don’t normally see it when you’re buying a commercial property. There is a charge of HST on the commercial portion only. So if it’s a 100% commercial, you’re paying HST on 100% of the purchase price. If it’s a mixed use building where say, it’s 30% and 70% residential, then you’re going to pay HST purely on the 30% of right now that HST, you know, I don’t want anybody to get worried that, oh my goodness, I’m going to pay another 13% to do that because that’s not quite what happens. So the mechanics are that there’s HST that’s charged, but then you take a I and basically an EITC. So I think it’s called States Purchase Blanket, right? There’s internal tax credit, but basically it’s an offset and your account and will offset the tax paid with the ITC and it’s basically carried forward. So you never end up having to pay it out of pocket. The only time you’re really exposed and again, this is more of an accounting accountant’s discussion, but when you convert a commercial property to residential use, there is an HST liability that that’s developed there. And you may be subject to paying HST at that point.

Georges El Masri [00:28:19] Got it. Got it. Okay, cool. Okay. Good to know. Yeah, I was always it was always kind of a question mark for me because I don’t own any commercial buildings. And I was always worried that you’d have to pay the full 13% HST on the entire purchase price. And I was thinking that’s a pretty big amount to pay in on the closing costs in addition to the closing costs. So yeah, it’s good to kind of get that. And I know I think there are certain factors in this. Like I believe you need to have an HST number in order to benefit from and kind of diverting that HST on the purchase rate.

Christian Szpilfogel [00:28:54] Yeah, absolutely. So when you set up your corporation and we tend to hold each of our assets in their own corporation, you’ll have a business number for your corporation and you have an HST number. You need the HST number, not just for the tax credit. Okay. But the HST number because the commercial rents are subject to HST. So you’re going to charge HST to your tenants and you have to remit that to the government on a quarterly basis.

Georges El Masri [00:29:20] Got it. Cool. All right. Well, I don’t want to confuse people too much here because we did cover some good stuff. Do you feel like there’s any final thoughts on anything we discussed or just any general advice you’d like to share with the people that are listening?

Christian Szpilfogel [00:29:35] Hmm. We covered mixed use buildings. You know, I’m doing redevelopment stuff as well, so we can certainly talk about that. But I think one thing that I want people to think about, especially in these more uncertain economic times, is don’t get caught up in the little details of what’s happening every day. What you need to do when you’re doing an acquisition, when you’re planning your business in real estate, is think about what you’re doing over the long term. So I see people, for example, always thinking, should I do variable rate or fixed rate interest? And the question for me is never about that. It’s very much about what keeps my business stable. And sometimes a fixed rate, even though it’s at a higher premium. It’s just another form of insurance to protect the amount of cash flow that you bring into your business. So I tend not to think about things on a short term basis. It’s very much about like if I do an acquisition. I have a business plan that includes the amount of cash flow, that includes the amount of forced depreciation that I’m going to be doing in that particular property. And that’s my business case. And then what I do is I try and reduce the number of variables of risk to make sure that I’m going to have a successful outcome. And if that means taking a fixed rate for two years while I’m doing the project, then I’ll take the fixed rate for two years while I’m doing the project.

Georges El Masri [00:31:09] Yeah, for sure. Yeah. Because you could see a pretty steep or a pretty big change in the amount that you’re paying in mortgage each month if you have a variable. Considering the increases we’ve seen in the last six months or so. So yeah, that has definitely impacted cash flow for a lot of investors. So it’s a good point you bring up. That’s great. I appreciate you sharing all this. Do you want to tell people how they can reach you and if you have any services or any events or anything like that coming up, feel free to share that as well.

Christian Szpilfogel [00:31:41] Sure. So our company, which I guess I didn’t mention at the beginning, is, is Olympus. So that’s alifer0 us dot k. You can find out most about what we do on, on our website, the starts here, but we do not take in joint venture partners. So I’m not looking for money. I did.

Georges El Masri [00:32:04] The first one, first one on the show.

Christian Szpilfogel [00:32:07] Where we self-fund everything that we do. Yeah. And the reason that I tend to come on to podcasts like this is to help educate people and make sure that they get on the right path. To that end, I’m also the vice president of the Ottawa Real Estate Investors Organization. We we’re a not for profit club. We charge a modest $127 a year just to pay for facility costs, etc.. And we have monthly events on the second Wednesday of every month with great speakers and we have great speakers. We’ve had, for example, Robert Cusack, he’s been with us. We’ve had a number of other really high profile people and we also have local investors sharing what’s there. So it’s a great group. And for any of your listeners that are in eastern Ontario or even beyond, you’re all welcome. We also have guests great for March as well. And it’s all about sharing.

Georges El Masri [00:33:06] Awesome. Great. Well, that sounds like a really cool thing. I’ll have to check it out one day. Held in Ottawa, is it correct?

Christian Szpilfogel [00:33:14] So it’s at the Infinity Center in Ottawa. So that’s near the airport.

Georges El Masri [00:33:19] Okay, cool. Well, Christian, thank you so much for joining me. I appreciate you sharing all this stuff. I learned and definitely a few things here. So appreciate your time and I hope you’ll enjoy the rest of your day.

Christian Szpilfogel [00:33:30] Great. Thank you so much, George. I appreciate the opportunity to be here.

Georges El Masri [00:33:35] Thanks for listening to this episode. Your support is truly appreciated and if you can share this with a friend or family member, that might benefit from the information. Remember, our goal is to motivate and inspire others to take action and to build wealth and to become well-off. Enjoy the rest of your day.

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