Table of Contents
Announcer [00:00:00] If you are looking for the skills and tools to succeed in real estate investing, you’ve come to the right place. This show is about breaking through barriers, breaking through limiting beliefs and breaking through to the life that you want to live through the power of real estate investing. This is the Breakthrough Real Estate Investing podcast, and now here are your hosts Rob Break and Sandy MacKay.
Rob Break [00:02:55] Hello, everybody, and welcome back to another show. Thanks for joining us again today. As usual, we have co-host extraordinaire with us Sandy MacKay. How’s it going?
Sandy Mackay [00:03:08] Awesome. Rob Awesome. Excited for another one?
Rob Break [00:03:10] Hear yourself doing well, getting a little tan on. So we’re still over here. We’re still overseas. Or I guess I don’t know if you call it overseas. We’re in Costa Rica still anyways and. And we had to fly across the sea to get here, I believe. But yeah, so we’re just trying to figure out exactly the logistics of getting back right now, which seems to be a little bit of a challenge. So I’ll keep you posted on that.
Sandy Mackay [00:03:39] It’s all good. This is this is part of the dream, I guess, and the plan for a lot of people that I’ve seen a lot of real estate investors down there. Yeah, this winter season and able to do, you don’t have kids go to school, there’s you’re able to function, I guess, relatively well still there this year. No more virtual world. So it’s cool. Yeah, it’s great for building wealth.
Rob Break [00:04:00] Exactly. No, we’ve had the opportunity to meet up with some of the people that are down here too. So it’s been it’s been good. It’s been good that way and share some ideas with people in a different atmosphere. So but you know, everybody listening, of course. As usual, go over to our website breakthrough RBI podcast dossier. There they can listen to all of our old shows, get in touch with our guests through the links and see all the other social media outlets that we have. They can access through that point, and they can also get our free gift.
Sandy Mackay [00:04:35] Yeah, the ultimate strategy for really wealthy real estate and you can pick that up. Get on our email list, never missed out on a show and join in on everything we’re doing online. They should also go like our Facebook page facebook.com slash breaks through RTI. That way you can join us as some of you are right now live the Russians. Join in the conversation. YouTube. We’re all over the place now live. So if you’re just listening to this and you want to. To an end, maybe with some live shows, we are pretty much every almost every Wednesday, every other Wednesday. 10:30 a.m. Eastern Time and we’re on here. Most of our shows are that time, so come join us and jump in the conversation as well as our life.
Rob Break [00:05:18] Yeah, I think that that’s really important. I mean, anyone listening today feel free to jump on there and ask Cody our guest some questions because I’m sure that everyone will be interested in what he has to say. So I would encourage everybody to get on their interact with us and, you know, go over to iTunes as well and just leave us a rating review. It helps us out a lot. So let’s get over there. If you have no chance and just leave us some words of encouragement or some of your thoughts of what you think about the show. Some things you’d like to hear, maybe that we haven’t covered, but at any rate, just tell us what you’re thinking. And we would greatly appreciate that we’ve got a bunch of five-star reviews, and we’re really happy to have everybody who has taken that time to do that. No, I don’t have the reviews up again today, so I’m not going to read any. But next time we’ll get to a few more of the reviews because we like reading those and hearing what you guys have to say and letting other people know what you guys have had to say. So we’ll get to that next time. But San Diego, anything else you want to cover before we get into it?
Sandy Mackay [00:06:27] Oh, not. Not, not really. I think this is an exciting one. It will be fun to share, you know, hear from our great guests coming on here. We’re going to talk about some different investment strategies, and I’m interested to learn as much as probably everyone else is. So I think we just get into it.
Rob Break [00:06:41] Yeah, I’m excited to Cody. Welcome to the show.
Cody Yeh [00:06:44] Hey, thanks for having me. I’m really excited to get on. I used to be driving around when I’m commuting from Toronto to Alice, then when I work at Honda and Breakthrough, a breakthrough is real estate pork, as was definitely always on my list and the library, and I just always put on one point five times that I listened to most of it.
Rob Break [00:07:06] Rob talks. I’ve never done that. I wonder what we sound like. It’s a little chipmunk action going on.
Cody Yeh [00:07:11] It depends. It depends on the speaker’s speed, but sometimes at one point five, sometimes two times.
Rob Break [00:07:16] Yeah, yeah. On Audible, I’m usually like a one point two. I like it just a little like, you know, I got to speed it up just a little bit. And then when you turn it back to normal speed, it sounds weird. So we probably sound a little off to you right now that
Cody Yeh [00:07:30] yes, no, no, it’s actually pretty good. I really focus on a content, right? And the content is really good. Like the boys are secondary to me.
Sandy Mackay [00:07:37] Yeah, I’m a one point three now because they changed it. I think he used to be one two five two five one five and now they got it more increments. I’ve noticed I’m a one three on Audible. If I was wondering
Cody Yeh [00:07:49] on Spotify with three times point 2.5 times, yeah,
Rob Break [00:07:54] well, you’ve got a really strong brain to take in the content at that speed, I’m sure. But once you do look at what you can do, look at, look at how efficient you can be.
Cody Yeh [00:08:02] Yes. Yes, that’s the key for it. You can slowly go up and your efficiency, the efficiency goes up too, and I realize I start talking faster as well. So I need to make sure I tone it down a little bit. So, you know, I could follow me, right?
Sandy Mackay [00:08:16] Well, we’re definitely excited to have you on, Cody. Could I don’t know. We were talking about this before the show, Cody. Yeah, yeah, Cody.
Cody Yeh [00:08:24] Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Sandy Mackay [00:08:25] Yeah, you got the hat on there for everyone. Wanted to say yes
Cody Yeh [00:08:29] to fire on this. I think your listeners knows what fire means. Financial independence, retire early and then I say, I’m loving it and helping my people achieving it.
Sandy Mackay [00:08:41] You’re totally loving it. And you came to Canada on a student visa when you’re 18 years old. Very little knowledge on wealth creation skills and it’s been about 11 years now. Yes, I do the math correctly. So you’re twenty-nine now.
Cody Yeh [00:08:54] I just turned 30 last October 30 now.
Sandy Mackay [00:08:58] Unfortunately, you’re with well with me, at least in the thirties, being a student and full-time project manager to a financial coach release, the investor stock options investor. I quite a lot of skills, obviously over that time and you quit your job in the beginning of 2020.
Cody Yeh [00:09:14] So we found that in COVID, you’re at.
Sandy Mackay [00:09:17] Yeah, great time to do that.
Cody Yeh [00:09:18] So maybe I’ll get fired. Either way, I don’t know.
Sandy Mackay [00:09:22] So it’s pretty, pretty interesting to go from that in a short time, you know, retiring before 30. And obviously you’ve built that the real estate through stocks and all that sort of stuff. So we’re going to get into that to the show and probably compare them a little bit to here. It’s out about which one do you think is better for, you know, for the right people and. Should be fun. So tell us a little more details about this. How the heck did you go from 18-year-old kind of a new newcomer to the country to building something pretty fast and substantial there and just over 10 years?
Cody Yeh [00:09:56] No, I would say I’m just like yourself the last 10 years before 2020. It’s almost like preparing all the bill king building blocks all the way up to a year ago, and that’s when everything takes off, right? But, you know, everyone now just look at the event, but a lot of people don’t see the process. And the process is when I first came to Canada, when I was 18, I thought I was probably top of my class in English. OK, not everything else, Neil. I have an Asian face. I’m good at math, I’ll have to admit. But in terms of English, I’m not the best one. So I remember first came here first math 12 exam. I don’t understand the question I. I raised my hand to ask questions and the instructor, and a teacher just give me a dictionary, and I was the one. I was like flipping over. I said, can you just come here and tell me yes, or no? Just yes, or no? This is what it means, then I can answer the question. That’s how bad it was. And then a fast, fast forward, you know, I basically apply to all the best schools around Canada. I chose to come to Toronto at that time is because no one’s in Toronto, so I’m a free kid. You know, my auntie is in Vancouver. I want to come to Toronto biggest city, more diverse industry, and then I decide to study engineer because, you know, I don’t want to write reports. I’m good at math. So on and on. I don’t think that was really true, but I really enjoyed the journey of engineers who really taught me how to grind, how to work very efficiently, how to work. A very, a lot of highly competitive people, right? And then they change my mind set to be very efficient. I took engineer as a major business minor and universally I learned a lot about accounting corporate finance stocks stock option. By that time, I only start trading, though I wouldn’t even call it trading, just investing in stocks starting in 2011, right? And up to the point where, like 2016, I start saying, hey, I should probably do a little bit of the trading and get into real estate. And that’s when I hop on a lot of your podcast. I started joining a lot of the real estate networking event around Toronto. At that time, I still wake up in wife finals, and so I basically whenever there was a juvenile driver hour down to Hamilton, drive an hour down to Mississauga, to Oshawa. And in the meantime, listening to podcasts, right? And whenever I’m not doing that, I’m busy doing day trading at night and the Asian market because of the 12-hour difference. And that was it, I’ll say, is a bittersweet experience. The better part is very stressful. At age 26, all my white hair was coming on to say, and you know, I spend an hour or two after my full-time job preparing an hour or two, trading an hour with two, actually a lot of time more than writing my report. And I look at my own report. I show it to my coach at the same time. So the first four months I was losing money. I slowly grinding down my $10000 account. But after four months, I started making money, and a year of sixty six percent did that for two years until I fell asleep in front of my monitor. And then meantime, I was actually training on my phone, trying out different options strategy and starting to realize, you know, I kind of put half the money here, half the money there. I said, do you realize you are my fault? A little bit more passive way. It’s actually a similar return, if not better, but better return on time and stress. And I can actually get my get my life back. Right. So that’s why 2016 was when I bought my first property at that time. I don’t want to use my first-time home buyer save up, I think, 30 to $50000. My mom want to buy a bungalow in Toronto. I say, Mom, can I chip in 30 to 50 thousand? I just take 30 or 50 percent. The ownership that time was half a million right now is probably, I don’t know, 800 900 to be conservative. Last few months probably pushed over a million. No. Then that was the first one. And the second one is I keep punching all the overtime when I was a full-time job and I save up for a down payment for my second one at twenty seventeen and then two more in 2019, I buy bungalow and convert it into legal duplex with the local team. Right. And a refi pull the money out and all that right. And that’s when I get a stop. And then, you know, now that accumulate a lot of a lot of capital and my trading account and I want to, you know, now that I don’t have a TV or job, I’m thinking maybe the most tax efficient way is to start getting into multifamily, right? And now I have the bullets for that. And that’s the next step. Definitely, while doing all the stock option. Training and training, coaching teach a course. And I actually do wholesale with one of the biggest flipper and Simcoe County and my partner, Simcoe house buyer. We flip to three house per month and then we’re ramping up our wholesaling site where we’re doubling our marketing costs for 2021. Put it on automation. That’s what you guys preach. I put automation only focus on key things, right? And that’s what we’re doing, and I’m very excited for that.
Rob Break [00:15:11] So you talked about a couple of things I want to get into. When you said it was bittersweet? Let’s talk about some of the challenges that arose there with the trading, the day trading. And let’s also talk about after that some of the more substantial challenges that you had getting into real estate.
Cody Yeh [00:15:31] Yes, we can touch on that. So the bittersweet part is, as I was working full time a Honda, I was trying to take on more responsibility because I was at that time, my goal was to climb the corporate ladder as fast as possible. I see a look at who’s the youngest one that climbed to. That’s the director level age 30. I’m like, OK, that’s my goal. I want to get there. So I said, how do I do that? So I try to take on more responsibility, work more overtime, like the average over time, I work from 2015 to 2019 as four hundred to eight hundred hours per year. So we put that into perspective, I lose probably 100 days per year, so a lot of time I don’t remember my summer. And on top of that, I was doing day trading at night. I don’t know what I was trying to prove by, I guess I’m trying to prove to the world or myself, is that, hey, I know most people lose money in day trading. I had the opportunity to have a good coach, which is two years younger than me. She’s from Taiwan, very successful. And at the age of 20, at that time she was 24. But she started at 18. So I was trying to prove that this is work. This is not worth this part of my lifestyle, right? Kind of trial and error, period. And it’s very bitter in the way where it’s very stressful and you feel like every day, you’re starting from the bottom right because we don’t any position overnight. So that means every day, even if you win 10 days in a row, today’s a new day. And that feeling is very scary because you’re only as good as your last of you guys know what I mean. But and real estate is totally different, right? And real says, we know the fundamental long term this is going to go up short term. I be some correction, but, you know, not stress about that because cash flow is sustaining our operating costs and long term, it will go up based on the fundamental analysis. So that was why I was bitter. And the sweet part is now that I’m not doing that, I can say I did that before. So anyone want to learn about that? You know, I have experience with that right? And jump into the second question is what changed after I quit my job? Yes. And that was a learning process to the moment I quit my job. The bank doesn’t like me anymore. Whenever I say, Hey, can I refi this? And they say, Well, OK, you’re T4. Do you still work? I said, no, I don’t. But my past two years of Norfolk six figure, they’re like, OK, maybe you should talk to a different bank. So I found a CIBC actually has a program for if you have a Norfolk three property, then they can use DCR, as I think is over 1.1 and one point to look at their overall portfolio. I think they can go up to like what’s I call LTV of 70 percent. So I was able to pull out some money, but not as much as I want after not having a T4. And now that any property I need to buy unless I pay myself T4, which I have that choice up to March 1st. If I want to do that in 2020, I might take some penalty depending on whether I pay myself for dividend or just other ways, right? But if I don’t, then I have very limited choice with traditional conventional lending.
Rob Break [00:18:47] Yeah, you know what? That’s very common. Answer to that question is a lot of times the answer to what the biggest challenges were when you got into real estate investing. It is always more towards the lending side, right? Where do I get the money from? But to your point, you work on it until you get until you find an answer. There’s an answer out there, and it may not be 100 percent perfect. Like you said, it’s for those listening. Maybe didn’t understand all of what Cody was saying, right? There is just like. So most banks will lend up to 80 percent of the assessed value of the property. So what? He was going back to refinance with the bank. He’s saying that the ones that he is looking at now are only lending him 70
Cody Yeh [00:19:32] percent, 70 percent.
Rob Break [00:19:33] But still, like, that’s a way that’s the way that they are able to look at you. And a lot of times the answer is just going to be not like, Where’s your tea for? You don’t have one, sorry, go somewhere else. But the challenge is then not going, oh, well, I guess I’ve done. Maybe I have. Maybe this real estate thing wasn’t for me to go and find the answer you’re looking for, right?
Cody Yeh [00:19:57] Yeah. And just, you know, and I was actually hench on the concept of getting the lowest interest rate. I know a lot of your audience focus on getting the lowest interest rate. Now, if you take a step back and you hear from many experienced investor as well as if you take a step back, if you look long term, what does that really point to five- or ten-point five percent comparing in the long term? If you can land the money and the appreciation is there, you will get more out of it over the long term. But a lot of people just focus on short term that if I can’t land conventionally, oh no, no, I’m not going to go to our alternative lender. I’m not going to pay one to two percent more. But if you still set up your business rate, if you buy a low enough, make sure your cash flow is OK. You have your sensitivity analysis; you have your reserve fund there. Then technically you can, you know, strategically take on higher interest rate and still work and two billion higher faster, right? So I think you guys can probably relate to that.
Rob Break [00:21:00] Well, you know, there’s my suggestion is always to people. And I’m sure there are good agents that work right for the banks, but we always like to use like a broker channel, you know, or I like to suggest that anyways, because then the options are they understand your goals, so they’re going to listen to you and go, OK, this lender, you know, is going to have a higher interest rate, but you’re going to be able to buy more properties. So you know, they’re going to be able to explain the tradeoffs and what they mean to work with you to build on your goals. So that’s what we suggest.
Cody Yeh [00:21:41] Very, very good suggestion. And nowadays hard to find a broker that have the time to sit down with you because they’re so busy. So when I start out, I have to touch on many broker. I learn a bit here, a little bit here, attending all the real estate seminar and put everything together. So I know which bank to go to first, then second, the third CIBC, RBC loss, right? All those things. I have to learn it from multiple people. Multiple broker. Right. Because they, you know, just to be very honest, everyone has their own agenda to right. So you got to make sure you trust, and you verify, right?
Sandy Mackay [00:22:16] Makes sense. Makes sense. So I know a lot of the lessons in the way you’ve shared so far. You’ve obviously worked very hard to be 30 years old and have a lot of knowledge around this and retire. I mean, it doesn’t happen overnight. You spent 11 years basically to get to that point. But you worked your ass off and you and you and you are grinded, and you didn’t take no for an answer in a lot of cases because you just found a way to make it happen. Was that pretty much being that the story with all of your investors? Like, what’s what strategies have you used with the real estate side? And was it always, you know, the one strategy that stuck with or have you kind of tweaked it along the way?
Cody Yeh [00:22:50] So I look into multiple strategies I rent to own, and I look into the wholesaling observe. I am basically doing BR, not for the first two property. I just bought it. I thought, hey, if I ever one day going to move in there as a family, that’s where I going to stay. But this third and the fourth one I look at as a burr, right? And I try to pull out most of the money. So it’s kind of like an infatti house or what we call it. But I haven’t done like crazier things like, you know, having to take on a bigger scale like multifamily. I haven’t taken retail plaza, which had a group of friends are doing those even down in space. But so far, you know, in my opinion, I still think multifamily, you know, if you can get the right number, I think I still make a lot of sense because there’s technology is changing so fast, right? Just for the past year or so, in the future, we have to make sure that is still working. And then technology has really replaced a lot of brick and mortar. So I think a lot of people think there’s opportunity there, but I still want to bet on things that will work in the long term not trying to pick a really cheap investment. But it might not work. I’m just hoping that to rebound, right? So I still think personally, I think multifamily will work out well in the long term because we just have more people come in to, you know, certain area and we need a place to stay right. And the supply can keep all of that demand and certain area. And Toronto, your and can’t.
Sandy Mackay [00:24:17] Now, are you really active on these deals? Do throughout your career so far? Have you been the one like leading the doing the project? Yeah, maybe hiring contractors as needed and all that sort of stuff managing it. Maybe yourself too.
Cody Yeh [00:24:27] Yeah, yeah. So I was always the buying. I was always on. My name is always on the mortgage. I put the deal together, you know, I put a dedicated bank account to make sure that county size easy. I have a quick book attached to me do the consolidation myself. I should do it. More often than not. It’s quite painful to chase one year and contractor wise, yes, I’m great. I fell. You know what I invest in? Bury my two little duplexes and bury one has an Alliston bungalow is in Toronto. So when I was in Bury, I found a good career to a good investor or integrator. Then he basically took me out of all the local contractor, which, as it turns out, to be really competitive price. It took a bit longer than I wanted to, but to me, as if I saved twenty thirty thousand, I and I, you know, get the operating cost of not renting out anything is one to two K per month. I’ll take it any time. So yes, there’s give and take. It’s not like always you need to be getting on the point. There’s always things that comes up and just how do you adapt to it? Right?
Sandy Mackay [00:25:37] Ultimately, whoa. How did that lead to getting out of your career? Like, how did that actually play out? Was that a? Was that always your goal? I guess. And then also, how did that happen so quickly, you know, before 30 is that most people are past that point. They may be looking at before 40 or 50 or 60. And how did how did you make that happen so fast? And is that something like, would you do it the same way if you were to repeat that? Or what did you learn along the way?
Cody Yeh [00:26:01] You know what’s funny, though? That’s a really good question. I never. Now, the more I sometimes when I take a shower, I think about things I did for the past 10 years, if I can do anything differently. And in hindsight, if I know real estate early an age of 18, maybe I would just get my license. Maybe I’ll never go to school again. Everyone don’t take it the wrong way because I know a lot of people as I want my kids to go to school. But if you have to drive like I do or like Sandy, you are like Rob, as if you start a lot earlier and then not say, if my parents say, hey, allocate this money for education at that time, international students are very expensive. As a thirty-three, I started with twenty-seven thousand just tuition. First year I graduate, the last year was thirty-three thousand just tuition. OK, so imagine I take that money. I say just by. Just close my eyes by any bungalow in Toronto. I just live in a house, hackett. Meanwhile, everyone’s going to school learning about algebra, calc calculus, which I don’t really use anymore, which I still know. But if I just go all a hustle and I find a mentor, I Sandy where Rob and I say, hey, I have nothing to lose, but I just have time and energy. What can I do? Maybe I’ll be way ahead of game right now. Ribose high. Not everyone can take that route. It’ll be a lot more beating because mentally I was probably not ready because of four or five years of education. That trainee was very competitive people. So maybe I wasn’t there. But if I have a choice and you know, I have nothing to lose. Maybe I’ll choose the right. I know sounds kind of crazy, but in the high side, I will probably do that. I think I’ll probably go further and maybe I wouldn’t quit my job at twenty-nine, be able to quit at twenty-five or never quit. And my portfolio will be a lot bigger because I’ll learn a lot of what I know from marketing, from talking to an investor, from raising money from just high tech is selling all that. If I learn early on, I think that will make a huge difference. I never learned on school. I never learn at school. Even I taught one of the top school. Have you got any marketing? And he sells class? I feel like they don’t do it himself. Or at least they’re holding something back. They’ve not really telling me I sell.
Rob Break [00:28:16] Yeah, I think it takes that aha moment. Like, like, you know, for me, I didn’t have the money to invest in real estate, so it never crossed my mind until I was seeking out education and found a way to do it without money. Who knew that that was even existed, right? But then you have that moment. I think that’s what it takes, right? So I would have loved to learn it earlier as well. I think it’s just a matter of, I guess, seeking out the information, right?
Cody Yeh [00:28:51] Yes.
Rob Break [00:28:52] And don’t know what you don’t know. Yeah.
Cody Yeh [00:28:55] And then one thing I learn, you know, not just for myself, but a lot of people out there is I understand when you’re starting out, you might not have the capital to invest and a good trainer or a good training course, a good mentor. Of course you have to trust but verify everything because you know, when you don’t have a lot of money, that money is very important. But if you can find one or even volunteer and say, can I help out with some of the things? And meanwhile, shadow, you know, that’s a good way to learn. And now exponentially reduce amount of mistakes you make. So I see that both in real estate and both and stock option investing. If I could have found someone, you know, I would teach me early on what to do and how to raise money and all that which, you know, that’s kind of what I’m doing now. I don’t know why I’ll be. I think there’s no limitation to age like now that I realize now I just turned 30 when I talked to people. No one cares about my age, so throw it out of the window. You’re 60 or 50 or 40 or 20. It’s how much knowledge you really have and how much experience you really have. And I make sure everything I say, I did it myself. So I learned that mistakes what not to do and what to do. Then I feel confident sharing and I hold that very close. So that’s how I keep my reputation there, right? If it doesn’t work out, at least I know if it doesn’t work out, how can I turn it around because I happened to meet before?
Rob Break [00:30:23] Yeah, absolutely. And you can learn from those mistakes. And you can also, like you said, you get out there. You meet people that have been doing it, you find that mentor and they can also help you avoid those mistakes as well, right?
Cody Yeh [00:30:36] Big time, big time.
Sandy Mackay [00:30:38] Why don’t we transition into stocks and real estate? Let’s talk about let’s compare them a little bit. I want to know what your strategy is, what stocks do generally. I know it’s probably changed over time, but generally, what ones have you use and what do you see today and then? And then let’s compare them a little bit what the pros and cons of each.
Cody Yeh [00:30:54] Yeah. So I started in 2011 stock investing. At that time, I was looking at it. It just boring stocks like Loblaws are looking at. I think that. I was looking at some Ambridge TDI, and I just put the money in it. I like the dividend and just forget about it. A year after a 10 20 percent, OK, good. I participate in Alibaba IPO. I bought it right when it came out. I remember it was 120 in 2014. I still remember a couple of months, went out to 100 stay at 100 for a couple of months. You’re not. I look back. You’re like, Alibaba is here, but when you’re at that time, you’re like, oh my God, did I make a mistake? That time no one knows what Alibaba is like. E-commerce thing wasn’t big yet, right? And fast. Fast forward to like 2016 to 2018. That’s when I was doing day trading as I was actually trading the Stock Futures Index of Taiwan and Hong Kong. So that’s kind of equivalent S&P 500 just, you know, the overall benchmark. Right. And I was doing that at night and, you know, while in the daytime was using my phone plays some option strategy right by. Kind of like buying lottery a little bit, taking calculated risk. A little bit playing on the selling side a little bit and see which one fits my rule as well. Right. And after twenty eighteen, when I stop day trading, that’s when I think the strategy basically perfect the strategy to find a strategy. I took many, many course online, offline, once in U.S., once in Canada, and I know all the pros and cons and that’s when last October, I’m a 30th birthday. That’s when I ran my first course for my all stock and options. So for people doesn’t know it’s I don’t just came off a nowheres because of all those things I did. I blew up my account multiple times before from day trading, right? And all that. And that’s because I started small money. So it doesn’t hurt me by blue out there. And then I, I recover, go further. So I know what to do, what not to do in the long term, right? And now that what I do is I just do on my phone, I do mostly sell, say, 80 percent selling options. That means I’m like the insurance company where I sell someone a policy. I collect a premium. And if someone the other side never make a claim, I keep all the premia. But if they do make a claim, then I have to buy 100 shares of the stock I want and the long term that has a good fundamental and I just have to buy 100 shares of that at a discount. So that’s 80 percent my strategy, another 10 20 percent, depending on timing, depending on the certainty in the market. I do buy some options as well, whether it’s short term or long term, and that’s where I composé my return. Like I make my bread and butter from the 80 percent selling options. But 10 or 20 percent is where I say I can increase my return by twice. But if I lose, my return goes from 40 percent over a year over year to thirty-six, so I can take that 10 percent decrease from 40 to 36, but potential I can make 80 percent right. That’s really the goal. So even if I lose everything on the buying side of option, I only decrease my overall return by four percent. That’s what I’m trying to do, and I use those money to buy more real estate, right? Right now, I’m accumulating a lot more. And now that I’ve Corp. and all that, I’m just going to go buy multifamily and now that know VIP clients with high net worth fits. I talk of a lot of things like, hey, if I buy, you know, I do wholesale, so I come across a good multifamily. Do you guys want in? Probably, you know, I’m not sure a one point five million that you guys have full of them. So each of you guys come up with two hundred and you’re like, Yeah, sign me up. I know you’re doing wholesaling. You can buy off market. I know you. You’re going, no, you run your spreadsheet. So I make them a lot of money. So they have a lot of trust in me. So I just start that last October. I have a group of good people supporting me and I make them a lot more money and they’re very happy.
Rob Break [00:34:55] That was your birthday present to yourself.
Cody Yeh [00:34:57] I was going to do it a week before my 30th birthday, but I just say someone told me, Hey, that’s Thanksgiving in the U.S. I’m like, you know what? Screw it, that’s still on my birthday. That’ll be the coolest birthday present ever. Gift myself. It’s I make a lot of money. I help a lot of people get to the next level, right? And I would just go celebrate after the Sunday I did over a weekend at six pm, a Sunday I go celebrate and I was training the first course I was training. I had those first I did it talk for eight hours per day, two days in a row. I would just me some guest speaker, but man, I was training my mentally, physically.
Rob Break [00:35:34] So tell us a little bit about this. Like, what is it and what will the people learn?
Cody Yeh [00:35:39] So. Yes. So I call it a stock option beginner course. Now I’m about to announce intermediate course. You guys, actually the first one to hear outside of my alumni group announced a couple of days where I beginner courses more towards people that has minimum experience and options. A lot of them. I have experience and long-term investing stocks and. And register or register account right now, they want to get to the next step. How do you get a more consistent income? Right? And if by they want to learn how to sell option, how to do it right, how to pick the expiration day, the strike price, how to pick the stocks right. And there’s a lot of stocks out there. A lot of hype, too. So how do you do that and when in the long term, that’s more geared towards, let’s say, a lot of. Most of my alumni, real estate investor, they make quite some money in real estate now. They’re like Cody. I still live very poorly because I look on the paper a millionaire, but I don’t have a lot of money to spend because the cash flow is not there. Or is there then a lot of time as it goes into my reserve fund, I want to make sure if something goes right, so they want my cash flow. So I say, why not? You allocate some money into this cash flow, generating a beginning course. I’m teaching where it will help your lifestyle take out a lot of stress. And meanwhile, you can actually increase your savings faster and you can take that money that you make and buy more real estate. So now you have more option of the size creative financing, joint venture raising money. Now you can actually speed up the process. If you don’t want to do any of that, you want to buy faster. So instead of buying one per year now, it can buy two per year because the money sitting on the side is actually generating a lot more return. Right. And you can put it back into real estate investing, right? And then, you know, I don’t want to go to advanced, but you can put in the core get start shuffling money, never go to your personal level. So it’s all very efficiently and you’re caught and let the money grow faster and less tax. You’re paying right?
Sandy Mackay [00:37:43] Stocks can be great. Real estate can be great. What’s the what have you found has been your greatest return on investments? We’re going to talk about time, too, so just focus on the actual just dollars, four dollars return that you’ve found.
Cody Yeh [00:37:56] Yeah, real estate has now. So all my legal duplex when I run numbers, OK, I was on Andrew Hines podcast. Shout out to Andrew, his great guy. I was out of his pocket, so he actually ran a cash flow sheet on the side and was running my number. So that’s, for example, one of the property you bought, and Barry was four. Oh, five, OK. January 2019. Four or five k. So after repair value at that time, I was. We’re aiming for around five sixty, right? And then, you know, rents and I have property management. I put in three to five percent maintenance costs and all that. After all of that, I put in two percent appreciation year over year. ROI is seventy five percent. So cash on cash flow. And he ran out data. As you say, it’s seventy-five, Andrew. And he didn’t trust me. You just ran out of seventy-five. I said, What about three percent? And he ran it as night. So even three percent appreciation is a 90 percent. So a lot of people as a Cody, why are you still doing stock? And option thing I say is quite different because I’m very conservative. All that three percent, even though, you know, the past two years and bay or anywhere like in Oshawa, Hamilton, just 10 20, something more like the past few months, probably just over 20 percent. That’s nuts, right? But that’s, you know, we don’t know how long the music will keep playing right. And I want to make sure if I only get, you know, a full property, if I only get a thousand $2000 passive income from those property, I want to I can’t really retire on that. I have all of a sudden, a furnace goals or roof goes, that money’s there, right? I never take our cash flow, find my property. They just always in there is just sitting in my bank account. Keep going up, right? But that don’t generate it’s good. Like long term. I just close my eyes. I don’t think about it, you know, and five, 10 years, I know my double. And because as inherent, inherently three to five times leverage because I grow up to 20 or 30 percent, sorry, 70 to 80 percent. So I’m leveraging my money three to five times. So that’s why that return will go from go up to seventy-five or 90 percent, even just, you know, with two to three percent appreciation, right? But on the other side, the stock side, I don’t use leverage. I don’t use much maybe up to like, let’s say, up 20 percent mostly. But then, you know, the return I’ve been getting is it’s there, it’s up there. I can’t promise, but I’ll just say a minimum of four percent really per months, at least for the past three, three years, right? But 2020 has been orders over 100 percent. But I don’t count on that, but as because I don’t leverage at all. But if I don’t leverage, I can still get that kind of return. And those are the cash I can, whether spend our lifestyle, spend on savings, spend on my marketing to get my business to a next level. That’s the money I can use, right? And that’s takes a lot of stress off my shoulder in case the real estate didn’t go up, furnace goals or something like that. So that’s how I look at it. One way is kind of sustaining and then. And it helping with the axillary income that comes in to stabilize my lifestyle up my marketing up my expense and all that, but the other side, the wealth generation, so it’s real estate special in Toronto. I think if you’re down in Alberta, up in B.C., you know, might be a bit different. But in Toronto, around Toronto, I’m still quite bullish on it just because everything I’ve seen and all the stats are read and I’m an immigrant myself, so I know what it’s like to emigrate to U.S., what’s right to immigrate to Canada, especially to Toronto. So I think I could constantly say that, right.
Sandy Mackay [00:41:40] Great answer. I think that makes sense. I agree with a lot of that, too. And what about time, though? Because Real Estate’s sometimes I think people are worried about spending a lot of time there, and maybe they have a rough month or two where there is a lot of time spent, maybe repairs, maybe tenant issues, things like that. How does that factor in and does that change your thought on the on where the best return is at all?
Cody Yeh [00:42:02] Yeah, I will say I’m one of the fortunate one. I think I’m one of the lucky one. I’ll call myself lucky one and I think I’m lucky because I put in so much work. The way I’m building business, the way I do anything is I don’t look at what’s a maximized return by a look at how can I foresee any problem? How could I solve this problem? Make sure they don’t even show up, for example, on the real estate. So if I, you know, if I deal flat screen my contractor, I say, can you show me a couple of your past projects? And I talked to, you know, they’re there the clients and say, how does that actually work? Right? I don’t mean overpay a little bit on the contractor, so I make sure they’re happy every time I go. I don’t try to like, you know, ambush them and say, why are you not here? You know, I always try to bring coffee or try to beat McDonald’s, bring timmis, whatever. Just make sure they’re happy. And so, you know, there’s other times when I really need help to put on a mailbox for my duplex in the basement. Can you do it for me? Do like, yeah, no problem. I don’t. I don’t come up here, Cody, right? So I treat my all. My I want to call that an employee, but all my at my partner relationship really well. If I, whenever I do something great, reward them. Sometimes I bring a check to them, right? Just to make sure they’re all right. What? I pay my way through it. And that’s why I think I’m always on the short list. The same thing for Poppy Management Center for my age. I don’t like I’m not going to go to any of those agency. You deserve it. You did everything. You prescreened a house for me and me just I bought one of the house without sight unseen, right? So. So I think that’s how I become really lucky because I’m not very stringent. I’m not and not where I want to make sure everyone who did their job exceptional job. I pay my way through, right? And that’s how I do and real estate. And so I didn’t run in big problem. Yes, I have a tenant that now was definitely creating some drama, but I have property manager there to deal with that. And I told them property managers, you know, as long as they’re happy, if they want to move out sooner or later, whichever. I don’t mind losing one month out of rent, but that takes a lot of stress off you guys, and the rents kept going up so we can reset, right? So there’s only a small chance of time that really cost a little bit of stress. And now the flip to the stock side stock options say, I’ve been doing it quite a while. I know what works, what not works, and now I just do on my farm. You know, how can I make 90 trade and 30 minutes? So some of the people, like Cody, are not straight. So I have because actually the moment I make trades, I screenshot, I make six screenshot today because there’s too many trades right at the moment that the night before I say, hey, tomorrow, this is probably going to happen in the morning. I said, these are the things I’m looking at throughout the market, but I’m going to do these traits so they already getting ready. And then I’m sorry, I prevent them with my reasons afterwards, right? So they learn and then follow, right. So sorry, I plan. I think I just always plan ahead, right? So I spent like probably 30 minutes to an hour before the day to plan, and I spent about 30 minutes trading. And that’s it. From 9:30 to 10:00, I tray and then so
Sandy Mackay [00:45:14] if an hour, it’s hour a day is there, it sounds like, yes, I know there’s probably a bit more behind the scenes, but the active work is an hour a day give or take because
Cody Yeh [00:45:23] trading? Yeah, an hour day and I do it anyway, and this is what I’m passionate about, so I don’t feel like it worked. So now that punch in the trade, the day is mine. I go on podcast bill, my other business, right? It’s all my
Rob Break [00:45:37] you know what I thought was really interesting. There is you consider yourself lucky and I don’t believe that that in any way is the right use of that word. Because, you know, everything that you said to back that up was all preparedness. There’s no luck involved in that whatsoever. Nothing fell out of the sky, and it was handed to you went out and you prepared yourself for all of the opportunities that could come your way. And that is actually how you did it, you know, it doesn’t sound to me like luck had much to do with it. But, you know, I think that’s a really important lesson as well for everyone to understand. I don’t think that that’s lucky at all, though. You know, it’s. But I do believe it’s interesting that you think that way. So I don’t I don’t know how we get into analyzing all of that. I think it’s a good tradeoff.
Sandy Mackay [00:46:32] There’s reciprocity to reciprocity to really throwing that out there. That’s when people get lucky. Generally, there is someone off luck here or there, but consistent luck is because you’re throwing, well, preparedness for sure as well. And you’re ready. You’re ready for when the luck comes absorbing it through and you throw it and you’re throwing out reciprocity in the world, which comes back in the form of luck sometimes.
Cody Yeh [00:46:53] Yes, yes. And really just parties anticipating problem and try to solve that before it comes up, because that’s when it’s the easiest to solve it, right? I always know my worst-case, best-case scenario. Most of our focus on worst case. I OK of all, the worst case and real estate, all the worst-case stock, an option. I can sleep like a baby at night and the rest is just upside to me. That’s how I look at it.
Rob Break [00:47:17] So we’ve talked about the stocks. We talked about the real estate. What else do you have on the burners?
Cody Yeh [00:47:26] So, so for the longest time and 20, I think, 2019 beginning or 2018, late 2018, my girlfriend, my age agent up and berries like Cody. If you ever think about can your real estate license, get in now? Because our yeah, my turn to Humber College. That time, we don’t know how that’s going to look like, but just sign up for my first course and then I pass it with high grades and then I forget it for a year. And now that I’m coming back to revisit two, of course there’s some sunk costs, right? I’m already doing investing. I really enjoy this. I’m like, I’ll get it. And now it’s at the point where, you know, I was talking to Sandy about now that I did all this, I have a clear idea of why I become a real estate agent. It’s not just as simple as I want to find another job to hustle as how I can leverage with what I have of social media with my followers. If I mean VIP clients with more high net worth, people are seeing what I’m doing. I know there’s a lot of potential to go even further in that direction, right? Whether that’s joint venture. And then we, you know, we go, share away. I say, hey, you know what? I’ll help you guys find a good deal. I take the front end or the back end or is later down the road, helping out some of my clients to say, hey, you know, buy or sell this. It’s not for me to kind of go out there. And, you know, of course, I want to practice on all the fundamentals, but is not very efficient for me to go out there and knock-on doors and cold calls, right? Which a lot of agents, I really respect that. But I’m again, I’m very lucky in a way. I built that up. I think I can start kind of a second floor, right? And I don’t want to put that to waste because I know whatever the broker I join or whatever, and then my partner is going to team up with me. They can get all the knowledge and all the things I already built up. It’s almost like package for them, right? So I don’t want to put that to waste and I’m ready and chat with Sandy and Sandy knows about this and my joining your team.
Sandy Mackay [00:49:24] Yeah, well, how what about the YouTube stuff? Because you’re all over it? You want that?
Cody Yeh [00:49:32] Hey, you know what’s funny, though? I only have 15 VIDEO But again, I’m lucky I got 11000 subscriber with 15 VIDEO And when I first start, guess what? I spoke Mandarin for the first two video because I don’t know who my audience is, right? I was studying a law like that and then I was frustrating. I was freaking out the camera, the scraping, what topics you talk about, how do I do edit? Should I use Adobe Premiere? Should I use Final Cut? Man, that was painful, right? But fast for like two videos after I, I look at the back in. It’s just like yourself. You look at a lot of stats on your back, and I see most of my listeners are from North America, even when I speak Mandarin. Most of our listeners in Canada, U.S., maybe a little bit Singapore, Hong Kong. Where do I get pay most of the money? Where do most of the money that that’s where the most people have the money to invest? North America OK, great. I’ll switch to English right away. So starting my third video. It’s all English from then on. And then there I spent a lot of time like a researcher. So it’s just said you guys, when you want to talk about things, you want to talk about evergreen things, five-year tenure down the road, when people come back and refer to it as still works for me, I took the longer wait. I 80 percent my content on Evergreen, so it still makes sense five to 10 years down the road. But 20 percent of it is the trendy side where I guess some traffic in, but I want to make sure those traffic. If I get in the audience, I want a target. It’s not just random people that want to gamble and go big or go home. I don’t want those clients. I don’t want those audience right. So I make sure my video reflect those. And again, I’m really lucky in that way. I figure out the beauty algorithm in the background. So one of my videos jump on that U2 algorithm. And now, I think is probably around one hundred sixty thousand hundred seventy thousand views. And that one video brings me an 80 20 percent ROI Brigsby and 80 percent of subscriber. 80 percent the money. YouTube’s pay me a couple grand per month, just so that that was no joke. So. So that video almost killed me. I spent 30 hours on it, and my girlfriend is helping me editing because everything has to be perfect script down to the word. Every picture that comes out and he lies, and he squares. It comes down to the T. There’s no garbage for 50-minute video. I cut it down to 12 to 13 minute, right and how everything is place. And I don’t lose anyone. Good transition. Good flow like that. VIDEO Almost kill me. So that was the video
Sandy Mackay [00:52:12] that I don’t know how you find time to have a girlfriend now that you mention that, as you must be like, it was Arista editing. Find time to do all that. That’s what I think a lot of people might listen to your story and think after 30 hours and not expect this. I’m working all day and all night. I’m working too, especially when you had a job. How the heck do you find time to live a life?
Cody Yeh [00:52:31] Before I quit, I was a lot more stressful because I tried to drive my girlfriend to work and try to pick her up after work. But now that I quit the job, I just work at home. That’s where I left. I this is my dad. It’s not the virtual background. This is real background. There’s a set house here. This is a real background, and I moved to a place that make my girlfriend watch RBC. She’s a superstar and financial advisor, so I don’t I don’t feel bad. What I say, you know, she asked for money. Ask people for money to invest in RBC’s mutual fund, but she actually asked me to manage her fun. I don’t. I’m not ashamed of saying that I don’t feel bad because she still killed it like their branches number one and GTA right now, and she’s the number oneself in that branch. So that says a lot to me. Very nice girl. Very, very good in all that. So from that point, I say, hey. So after I quit, my job said I going to move to a place where see me sometimes see me. Some stress I used to live like 50-minute drive from where she works. I drive to work, drive her off work. Sometimes even when I’m around there, I just buy lunch for her. But I say, you know what? That’s moved to within a hundred-meter radius. OK, let’s move there. So if I work from home, I go, I’ll play golf. You can come home for lunch, I can prepare lunch for you, and you can always see each other. Even though I’m busy, I’m busy at home, right? That’s how I keep that. And really, I don’t need to stay anywhere. Of course, now they get into the more real estate agent side, then I have to be local. But up to that point, all my business was built so that I can go anywhere in the world. That’s what the fire really means to me. But now I want to take it to the next level. So I don’t mind taking a break on not going anywhere in the world, but I still I still can do that. But I want to take a break on that and build something within the next five years or so. From there, I could really have more power and ammunition to lift that kind of fire life, and I want to help more people to achieve that. Along the way. I saw it just, you know, I think you guys are the same. Retired doesn’t mean sitting on the beach. I tried. I did that for two days and I just get agitated because
Rob Break [00:54:44] it’s very hard. It’s very hard to go. Like for me, if I go to do something like leisurely, it’s it doesn’t take long for me to get bored of it. I’m pretty quick to get bored of leisure time. But yeah, no, you know what I like. I’m sure everyone can feel the enthusiasm and see the enthusiasm that you’re bringing to everything that you’re doing. So I commend you for all of that, and we’ve learned a whole bunch of interesting perspective today. So thank you for coming on and sharing all of this. It’s been fantastic to have you here.
Cody Yeh [00:55:22] Yeah, it’s great to be on. Definitely a very happy to share all that.
Sandy Mackay [00:55:26] I love when we have our listeners, you know, for years, come on to because it’s this that’s that makes it pretty cool for us to have people on the WHO said, I learned this, I learned this, I used to listen. And now all this stuff you’ve done to come back and share with the audience is amazing. So yeah, yeah, I definitely appreciate you as a listener and as a guest. And now a past guest in a few months.
Cody Yeh [00:55:49] Yeah, it’s almost like a dream come true for me because I’ll. You know, I never knew I’ll get on podcasts like this, right? And because of all the work, all the luck, right? And brings me here and now, I feel very fortunate in a way where I don’t feel I have made it, but I feel I prove a point to myself, as you know, don’t dream so small. And I know sometimes, you know, there are so many moments where I think men that could maybe could have killed me before I quit my job. I say, what if you know, all of a sudden like COVID happened and then I can’t make much money on the stock options. So I only have real estate. But OK, worst case, I’ll sell a lot of my property where I refi one of my property. Right. Then I’ll take our money from there to left. And of course, hindsight is actually doing Kovic coming out of make way more money in 2020 than any other year, right? But that was just I don’t think, you know, I wouldn’t say I anticipated that, but I have my worst-case scenario planning out. So from there, it’s all upside to me.
Rob Break [00:56:51] Yeah, there is definitely a lot of unseen opportunities that came out of that for me as well, just things that surprised me that, you know, when you look back on, it wouldn’t have happened without it. So I mean, I’m not set the buying. By no means am I saying is good. It’s just that, you know, you’ve got to look hard and find ways to create those opportunities, even in bad times, right? So how can people learn more about your course and how can people get in touch with you?
Cody Yeh [00:57:21] Oh, I’m actually running. I just start that I run right to free webinar, which there is close to 300 people sign up and 150 people show up on my first free webinar. I’m constantly trying to improve get feedback, even for just a free webinar. And there’s an upcoming one this Thursday at eight p.m. Eastern Time, Feb. 11, which is tomorrow night, isn’t it? Which is tomorrow night. And then from there on every two weeks, I’ll do one. So for anyone or even a lot of my alumni has friends or family or interest, I say now that you guys make money, you guys see how I make money. You guys trust me. You want your friends and family to learn similar thing. Reach far even faster, no matter what their ages know. Channel them to this free webinar doesn’t cost you anything. Of course, I’ll show you my course and how much that costs and all that, but I think everyone is prepared for that and people come on the ready, take it to the next level. If they don’t take, my course is all good. At least you learn something, and they show a lot of common rookie mistake. At least you don’t blow up your account like I did. You know, on GMA, I didn’t do Jimmy. Stop it back in the days. I’ll probably play it. I just, you know, avoid a lot of mistake and you learn if you take a one or two things from that. I think so worth it. So there’s a free webinar. I have a website called Cody Ebtekar. So Cody y E.H. dot com, you can find, you know, in the future, this podcast will be on my website as well. And you know, there’s all the information about my beginner course. I’m working on an intermediate course. I will come out and, you know, I’m on Instagram. Cody, on your score, on the score. Yeah, I know. So I took the Cody under square. Yeah. So I can only do on this one to score you and I’m on Facebook as well. I should have a free second option Facebook group where there’s nowhere for three thousand people in there. I don’t know. I don’t police that group as long as it’s not a scam. When our self-promotion, there’s all kind of crazy strategy, all kinds of beginner strategies we’re going to question, but people can feel free to ask question there. Many people help each other a lot of time to jump on, to help out as well. So I can probably put that link and the and the description or, you know, or people can just message me on Facebook or Instagram and asked me if they don’t see it. But if they go to my website, all the links are there, even the free Facebook group and a free webinar. The course everything is on my website.
Rob Break [00:59:47] Cody Adcom. Great. OK, yeah, perfect. Thank you. I’m sure lots of people are going to be interested and I’m sure hopefully you’ll see it increase in some traffic there soon. Yeah, nothing in it. Like, congratulations on the success that you’ve had, too. So you know, it’s very impressive what you’ve done at say.
Cody Yeh [01:00:05] Thanks. Yeah, thanks. And I think, Holly, both of you guys can relate as people like us. Sometimes you really need to take a break and look at what we have achieved, not in the way that we feel content, but Alis congratulate herself as well because a lot of time, like I know Sandy is probably saying things how do we get to the next level? Now we’re here, how do we get to the next one? We’re always looking ahead. And that’s how we have to plan, right? My plan is always six months one year out, but a lot of time we need to live in the present. When I’m with my girlfriend, my mom, I’ll make sure I turn on my phone. I’m just here because very precious time for me and I want to congratulate you guys, congratulate myself as well on achieving those.
Rob Break [01:00:48] Yeah, like time for gratitude is very important for sure.
Sandy Mackay [01:00:53] No, we don’t always make time for it, to be honest. If we’re if we’re fair and, you know, day to day, it’s tough to force ourselves into that sometimes. But daily is super important. I agree.
Cody Yeh [01:01:03] Yeah, definitely.
Rob Break [01:01:05] How can people get in touch with you
Sandy Mackay [01:01:07] to a nine three eight nine six eight four six or Sandy MacKay Realty Network dot com?
Rob Break [01:01:12] And people can reach me a Rob Mr Breakthrough Dossier again. Cody, thanks for being here and everybody for listening, and we’ll see you next time.
Cody Yeh [01:01:21] Thanks for having me. Now.